Home | About Us | Contact Us


Koi Forum - Koi-Bito Magazine straight from Japan
Page 9 of 10 FirstFirst ... 78910 LastLast
Results 81 to 90 of 93

Thread: Ion-exchange Softener for good skin?

  1. #81
    Sansai
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    indonesia
    Posts
    259
    Hello Jacovors,

    If you read the preceeding pages of this thread, you will know what actually we have been discussing about. It's about the benefits of having soft water (low TDS) for our koi. And in Japan my dealer Kiki wish to make sure that the TDS of pond water of the two foremost breeder, namely Sakai and Momotaro, is as low as Mike Snaden claimed - that is about 80 ppm. From my brief phone conversation yesterday with Kiki, it turned out that Mike S is correct.

    Hope for the meanwhile this help.

  2. #82
    Tategoi jacovors's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    South Africa
    Posts
    345
    Hi Kiky,
    Thanks for the info.
    That is exactly what I ment by sharing what you're dealer have learnt on his recent trip.
    Thanks
    Jaco

  3. #83
    Sansai
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    indonesia
    Posts
    259
    Jacovors,

    When I meet Kiki in a few days time, maybe I can supply exact data of what he has got. I'll be back to you again then.

  4. #84
    Tategoi jacovors's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    South Africa
    Posts
    345
    Thanks Kiky,
    Would be great.
    Jaco

  5. #85
    Sansai
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    indonesia
    Posts
    259
    Hello Jacovors,
    Are you still following? From our discussion this afternoon, I can summarise as follow:
    1. In Momotaro, Tds ranges from 60 ppm to 80 ppm in various ponds.
    2. In Sakai, Tds averages 100 ppm
    (This is of course assuming the Tds meter is accurate; which from the readings, it most likely is)
    Two foremost breeders in Japan have Tds of lower then 100 ppm in their ponds, which is in agreement to what Mike Snaden has been saying all the time. I can safely conclude that one of the factors to promote good growth, good health etc, is to have low Tds level just like in Sakai and Momotaro!

  6. #86
    Tategoi hewhoisatpeace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Pendleton, SC
    Posts
    331
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Snaden
    KH is there for the purpose of keeping the pH buffered. There is absolutely no benefit to raising it higher that necessary to achieve this. Some poeple have said that the filter needs KH... which is rubbish. The biomass don't feed on KH, but simply produce acids that try to lower the PH, which are then neutralised by the KH.


    Am I the only one that has a problem with this statement? Reading old threads, but I noticed additional reference to this idea that, to my understanding, contradicts the biological action of nitrifying bacteria. Respectfully, Mike, I disagree.

  7. #87
    MCA
    MCA is offline
    Honmei MCA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Atlanta
    Posts
    2,574
    I agree with Mike. The carbonates are there to offset the acids enough to keep the pH in the range where all the bacteria and koi can thrive.

    In a pH crash , good chance the koi suffer/die from high ammonia/nitrite when the bactera start to shut down.

  8. #88
    Tategoi hewhoisatpeace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Pendleton, SC
    Posts
    331
    My understanding of nitrification differs somewhat. Perhaps I am wrong.

    These are the equations I'm familiar with:

    Quote Originally Posted by The Water Planet Company
    Alkalinity buffering equation
    H20 + CO2 <> H2CO3 <> HCO3 + H+ <> CO3 + 2H+
    Nitrification equations
    NH4+ + 1.5O2 > 2H+ + 2H2O + NO2-
    NO2- + 0.5O2 > NO3-
    NH4+ + 1.83 O2 + 1.98 HCO3- > 0.021 C5H702N + 0.98 NO3- + 1.041 H2O + 1.88 H2CO3-
    NH4+ + 1.9O2 + 2HCO3- > 1.9 CO2 + 2.9 H2O + 0.1 CH2
    From the above equations, it can be calculated that for every pound of ammonia oxidized to nitrate, the following occurs:
    4.18 pounds of oxygen are consumed
    7.14 pounds of alkalinity as calcium carbonate (as CaCO3) is consumed
    12 pounds of alkalinity as sodium bicarbonate (NaHCO3) is consumed
    So, to my understanding, carbon is required in the form of carbonates for nitrification to occur.

  9. #89
    MCA
    MCA is offline
    Honmei MCA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Atlanta
    Posts
    2,574
    So the end result is the same. Kh that is too low can negatively impact the bacteria which will lead to rising ammonia and or nitrite which can stress or kill the koi.

  10. #90
    Tategoi hewhoisatpeace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Pendleton, SC
    Posts
    331
    Yes, the end result is the same. Understanding the process is important, too, though. It keeps one from making factually inaccurate statements that can steal credence from the remainder of your work. Most of Mike Snaden's stuff seems well-researched and accurate, I kind of hate to read things like that.

    The other possibility is that someone might know more than me (not hard to do) and might tell me that I am incorrect in my understanding. I am prepared to learn more that could positively affect my understanding, even if it negatively impacts my existing paradigm. However, until I learn more, it causes me to have to verify Mr. Snaden's teachings in order to avoid any other factual inaccuracies.
    Will Schultze
    (931) 338-6174



Page 9 of 10 FirstFirst ... 78910 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Ion Gen
    By Peppy in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 09-09-2010, 11:48 AM
  2. Do some of your koi have skin so good it glows?
    By luke frisbee in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 05-18-2009, 09:01 AM
  3. radiant vs exchange heaters
    By Greg P in forum Pond Construction
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 02-06-2009, 09:07 AM
  4. What is meant by good skin quality?
    By mingaun in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 31
    Last Post: 03-24-2008, 12:48 PM
  5. Ion-exchange Softener for good skin?
    By kiky in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 84
    Last Post: 10-12-2004, 11:02 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Articles - Sitemap - FAQs and Rules

KB Footer Graphic
Straight from Japan... For the serious hobbyist!
All content and images copyright of: Koi-bito.com