Showa In Warm Climates

[swordfish]

Quote: Originally Posted by soelistyo Mike, great reading. keep it coming please.

Quote: Originally Posted by soelistyo i'll always remember a koi dealer (in spore, same type of weather) once bringing up a sansai shiro bekko a month before a koi show. the fish was yellowish with the sumi looking dull. he told me to take a good look, cause in a couple of weeks it'd look very different. he put the fish in his chilled pond, and sure enough, 2 weeks later i went to visit him again and the difference was spectacular. it was snow white and the sumi much improved.

Soelistyo,

That is the reason why I do not intend to keep Shiro utsuri yet. I will need chillers or keep them in indoor pond with air-condition on 24/7.

SF

[soelistyo]

i've seen many beautiful shiros, in my eye, in unchilled ponds in these parts. still show the unique shiroji typical of shiro and thick, rich sumi in many examples. actually, the more common problem i see here with shiros is the body shape rather than the colors or skin failing to shine through. it could be that your standards/expectations of koi or shiros must be higher than mine, judging from your decision, cause i don't conclude that a chiller (though i guess can only help) is a prerequisite for keeping shiros.

[MikeM]

In the September 1995 issue of Rinko (English), there is an article concerning a rooftop pond in Okinawa, which has a subtropical climate. The author makes a point contrary to all I have read elsewhere, but for that very reason I found it of interest:

"Koi in Okinawa generally have brighter Hi. I wonder if there is a relation between the color of Hi and sunlight. In this matter, a koi dealer of Hong Kong also said that koi brought into Hong Kong from Japan easily gain the color of Hi there.

The koi in Okinawa may well have a peculiar color to them. I remember that bright color of Hi which Mr. Uehara's koi have."

There is insufficient information regarding foods used, bloodline of the koi observed or other data related to pigment to even speculate on reasons that might explain the observation. A photo makes clear that the pond in question was not even waist deep, unshaded and fully exposed to the sun. There is no reference to use of cooling equipment or even constant flow of fresh water, but perhaps water temperatures were being controlled by one means or another?

In the same issue, there is an article on koikeeping in Hong Kong which speaks of the ponds of three leading hobbyists. The design of one pond is reviewed in some detail, with a passing mention that the water temperature was controlled to be 15C from November through March, and 25-28C from April through October, with a two-month fast imposed. I would hesitate to draw generalized conclusions about warm climate koikeeping based on observations of koi kept in such a fully controlled environment.

As always in this thread, I am sharing information I come across and do not vouch for the accuracy.

[luke frisbee]

the keeping of koi is in its infancy, and at this time anything that is veiwed one time ( or even thought to be seen) becomes fact to as many people as the person that saw it can convince.
And the reason is whatever the person thinks as well....and the hobby perpetuates/promotes this kind of "information gathering"

[MikeM]

I was traveling recently and had a chance to catch up on some reading. An article in the September, 1997 issue of English Rinko focused on a koi farm begun by Mamoru Kodama in 1993 in Okinawa. Kodama is best known in the West, of course, for the commercial success of Miyoshiike and the books he has published. In the article he explained his thinking behind having a koi farm in subtropical Okinawa:

"In building a farm, one of my top priorities is to choose a place under the best condition. Miyoshiike has a lot of suitable places for breeding koi such as Gifu prefecture, Mie prefecture, or Shizuoka prefecture around Miyoshiike's main shop in Nagoya. But the reason I dared have the koi farm in distant Ishigaki Island, Okinawa is that the island has an important good condition which mainlands of Japan do not have. That is, Ishigaki provides Nishikigoi with the best natural condition that the average temperature through a year is 24C, belonging to a subtropical climate.

"Ancestors of Nishikigoi originally came from Southeast Asia, subtropical zone. They came to Japan by way of China. and has been improved to beautiful koi for years. Though Nishikigoi has been actually improved in Niigata, which has the severest winter in Japan, a mild climate is better for the inherent character of Nishikigoi. The climate of Ishigaki meets Nishikigoi's character. Nishikigoi originally has a constitution to be able to breed three or four times a year. I thought that it should have been possible that same koi can breed several times a year under the climate of Ishigaki. I, therefore, started the farm in Ishigaki 1600 km away from our main shop."

Kodama continues to say that the Ishigaki Koi Farm oyagoi are spawned three times per year. For the first breeding the hatch "is over 95%... But when it comes to the 2nd time, it goes down to 60%, and the 3rd time, 30%." He then explains how he is using his Manda Nishki product to obtain higher hatch rates, but does not say use of the product actually worked.

I found this article interesting for several reasons. Kodama challenges the idea of Nishikigoi being a four season fish, but then gives data negating his proposition. I'd not heard of Ishigaki Koi Farm and certainly am not aware of it being known for producing quality koi. It seems the locale best fit the purpose of maximizing production, but Kodama goes on to say that culling is very strict with only 2,000 pieces kept out of 100,000-200,000 fry at the first culling, and only 70-100 females kept to be nisai, which he says are typically 60cm when harvested in October.

I am thinking this article is more commercial promotion than it purports to be. However, I'm posting this excerpt for whatever worth it may have in the theme of this thread. I think it amounts to no more than what was long ago discovered in Florida. A warm climate allows for high production and growth rates.

[RayJordan]

Hi Mike,
I have heard Kadama-san talk about his experiment with a koi farm in Okinawa. It was discontinued some years ago because he said he was unable to produce enough high quailty koi there because of summers being too warm.

[KoiCop]

that's a most interesting addition to an already valuable thread.

[kingkong]

My two cents. I got interested in this color change behavior of koi when I noticed long term color changes in esp. kohaks and short term changes when I treated Shiros in a white tank, which would fade sumi to light grey in seconds.
Signals from the fish's nerves and or release of hormones can rearrange the chromatophores whith is common with cold blooded creatures. Alteration of surroundigs such as water temperature and water quality, nutrition and fish's disposition seems to effect the different layers of chromatophores thus changing pigment intensity or loss of pigment. Changes can happen in seconds or can be a long term change. This is a phenomena in the balance between differentiation and apoptosis (ordered death process) of chromatophores. Works for me at least.

[MikeM]

Thanks for the info, Ray. I figured there must be a reason we do not see Ishigaki Koi Farm on Taro's auction site.

[bekko]

The guy gets around. The Kodama family are setting up to grow out koi in Hawaii now. I believe we're a little milder than Okinawa - warmer in the winter, cooler in the summer.