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Thread: Koi That Fail

  1. #31
    Jumbo Akai-San's Avatar
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    So now I am going out on a limb and guessing here...Is it that these failing koi that are going so called "south", koi that have a lot of potential to even the most discerning hobbiest; are sold by breeders because THEY ALREADY KNOW that the koi, will not live up to the expectations of the breeder(s). So as nisai and sansai, they will be auctioned off for sale for thousands of dollars to the next unsuspecting dealer/owner? This would mean that the breeders, with all their experience, knowledge and know-how know "THE SECRET" to selecting the best for parent stock or for selling at $10,000-$20,000 or more! I guess it is their business to know better than anybody else...

    WOW! Kind of makes me not want to even take a chance on $250-$500 koi. Just play with pet $20-$50 koi that look nice for short time and then rotate new ones in and getting rid of the older koi before they get too big. At least you have the hype of getting "new fish" all the time.

  2. #32
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
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    There are all kinds, Akai-San, so I'm sure the underhanded are among the koi dealer/breeder ranks as well. However, keep in mind that each buyer may be looking for something different. A person who wants a koi to enter in a show and really take a shot at a major award is looking for a finished fish. A year later, she may well have passed her peak and be going down hill. Don't we all "fail" a bit more with each passing birthday? On the other hand, a person who is looking for a true tategoi ... a future fish ... is hoping that it will develop in certain ways. No guarantees in this world. Even the breeder cannot be sure what will happen, but the more knowledgeable of the bloodline the breeder is, the more likely the breeder's judgment will be correct. As to the dealer, they are at least a step removed from the breeder, so their judgment is inherently less reliable, although a dealer who works closely with a breeder over many years may be about as good as the breeder himself in predicting the future.

    Then, too, you have to remember that usually the breeder is parting with fish at the point when he thinks he can get the most for them ... before they start to go down hill. All tosai are culls, but I still enjoy getting some each year to watch them develop. And for someone looking to win GC at a major show, all Nisai are culls. Win an award at a major show in Japan? ... Well, somebody else would know more, but probably likely the breeder kept the fish until at least 4 or 5 years of age, if not more?

    In the end, get what you enjoy. If that's a $20 Ogon, go do it. If it's a 34" Kohaku in her prime, I'm glad you can afford her!

  3. #33
    Daihonmei dick benbow's Avatar
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    Bekko: I notice by the photo you look a little "bored"

  4. #34
    Daihonmei
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    Cool

    Dale,
    Dang it! what ya got to bring race into this.....and how come you are making it sound like bein' shiromuji is a bad thing?

    And B'ham huh? Well you were almost in the South then. if we'd have had the steel produced in B'ham after the "wah" during the "wah," The "wah" would have been over PDQ.

    bekko,
    Why would my birth certificate keep all them Mexicans from whuppin' my ass?

  5. #35
    Tosai
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    Thanks for all the interesting comments. The dealer from whom I purchased the Kohaku is quite secretive about the Japanese dealers he visits. There is some uncertainty as to the breeder so I will not name the possibilities.
    When the Koi was younger the red was a deeper colour, almost too crimson for the age of the Koi, however, the white was excellent. As far as I can remember the maruzome kiwa was present from the begining. As it began to grow it reverted to a more orange red. Colour enhancers had been used perhaps? I preferred the orange colour in a nissai. The centres of the scales seemed darker than the periphery. Optimistically I took this to be hoshi. Unfortunately, the before photos have disapeared from my PC. I will search through my old disks but I am not the most methodical of filers! I'll post the photo of the sibling.
    The sibling (sister) of this Koi is doing well, has grown nicely. The hi has also turned more orange but no sign of a window. The white spots are reflection off of the water.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Koi That Fail-twanesept04.jpg  

  6. #36
    Oyagoi bekko's Avatar
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    yes dick, i am

  7. #37
    Jumbo Akai-San's Avatar
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    Dr.,

    You pic shows a nice body on your koi. I'm always a sucker for nice body structure...Does sister have a great bod as well?

  8. #38
    Tosai
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    Yes, the Koi were similar in many respects, including shape.

  9. #39
    Daihonmei aquitori's Avatar
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    Talking

    My four step kohaku went south, went wrong, went shitty and went shiromuji. Pick the one you like. They are all bad!

    Dale[/QUOTE]

    I like "Went Shitty"....It explains it all in any country.. Oh yeah Brian, didn't mean to use foul language....

  10. #40
    Nisai estanque_koi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maurice
    Both kohaku posted give me a scary feeling...
    ... the maruzome kiwa looks a little frightening.
    Signs to look out for.

    Here is a snap of a famous kohaku I own which shows you the signs to look out for with regard to kiwa breaking up.

    Maurice.
    Hello Maurice,
    could you please explain further the signs that make Koi to be considered "iffy"?
    I understand that maruzome is Kiwa following the edge of the scales. Is that correct?

    Diego

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