Kohaku For Hard Water/High pH

[MikeM]

There has been a great deal posted over recent weeks about the negative effects of hard water and high pH on some Hi types. This leads to the question, for those of us burdened with hard water and pH 8.0, what types of Hi or bloodlines are most likely to be able to do well? (Or, should I say, not do terribly?) Since my water was softer and had moderate pH until about 18 months ago, my prior experience is of no longer relevant.

[dick benbow]

mike: my take on this is we're dealing with a moving target. Not all koi from the same spawn are equal and breeders change parent koi and mix in new genetics sometimes yearly. So if we were to buy a koi from say sakai, unless we knew that it was from Rose and a certain male we might get differing experiences.

For me, I think trying to adjust our water, tho costly might be less frustrating
in the long run. I have been "playing " with RO water but don't have the grasp yet on it that I'd like.

[koinut]

Hey Mike,

I too have had experience with kohaku from the same batch and ones I thought would turn out nice actually got shimi on it. But at the same token,
within that same batch, I have some that turned out really nice (without shimi). I understand also that Hoshikin is supposed to do very well in our hard waters. I was able to experience a tosai to nisai with good results. Good luck!

[MikeM]

Hmmmmm..... Isn't Hoshikin one of the breeders who lost their parent koi?

But, let's get specific: Does anyone have experience with Maruyama Kohaku in hard water w/high pH? Or, Hosokai Kohaku? Or, Torazo Kohaku? Or, Nagashima Kohaku? And, last: Matsunosuke Sanke? [Yea, if you haven't guessed, I've been thinking about making a new acquisition in time for our autumn growing season. ... just thinking (with a few specific fish in mind. )]

[koinut]

I can honestly say I don't know, but I have had good success in the past. I have also seen Kohakus from Momotaro in different ponds all with good beni and no shimi here in the West coast.

[woodyaht]

The fish I have with Hi on them are, Momotaro, Suda, Ito, Hosokai, and Brady B. My water is about 180/375 with a PH around 8.0-8.2. The Hi is constant on all my fish except for one Momotaro Nidan Kohaku that is getting secondary Hi between it's eyes and mouth. The only changes I have seen in the coloration of my fish is sumi come up over the winter.

[luke frisbee]

Someone brought forth a wonderful question in another thread months back..it got me quite excited in its depth of thought and understanding of people and koi....
They made me think that buying kohaku from a dealer with water that was different from yours, and who sells (and therefore culls for) to people with different water than yours Is going to potentially have thrown out koi that might have been right for YOU, and your water.
With the MASSIVE number of offspring a single pairing gives, a breeder learns what to cull out for his water and his cutomers.
A dealer with water similar to yours and who sells to people with similar water to yours would have developed an eye and established a pair/trio that would be good for you.
beautiful in its logic

[l113892]

Mike-

Do not choose a Torazo kohaku for hard water. Torazo uses Manzo bloodline and Manzo throws shimmies in hard water. I don't have experience with the others. I have an excel spreadsheet that has a lot of the information you may be looking for if you want a copy.

[tewa]

Quote: Originally Posted by dick benbow mike: my take on this is we're dealing with a moving target. Not all koi from the same spawn are equal and breeders change parent koi and mix in new genetics sometimes yearly. So if we were to buy a koi from say sakai, unless we knew that it was from Rose and a certain male we might get differing experiences. For me, I think trying to adjust our water, tho costly might be less frustrating in the long run. I have been "playing " with RO water but don't have the grasp yet on it that I'd like.

Hi dick

so far what are the obstacles that you encounter with RO?

tewa

[MikeM]

MikeP: I've sent pm.