Hanging your politics at the door

[Chris Neaves]

Hi Pieter,

You mentioned your postings on other South Africa koi forums. Some of your postings on Jaco’s forum had to be deleted by the moderator. After your posting on the Cape Koi Farms Forum it seems to have stopped dead in its tracks. You don’t post abuse on your own forum. Some of your postings are very interesting.

Pieter, before you get on your high horse again, take time to think about what you are doing – and yes, I am lecturing you. Cool off a bit. Use the koi forums to collect and then select information that will help you become successful at the hobby of koi keeping. Use what works for you.

What works for you may not work for some one else. And that’s great. It is a unique hobby of individuals, individual ponds, and individual taste in koi. When engaging in debate make your point, prove it and stand by it. If you are comfortable with keeping koi a certain way and its successful – then congratulations and welcome to a most interesting hobby. If other people have different points of view then respect them, just as you would like them to respect your points of view.

Once you take your eye off the goal – sharing information for successful koi keeping – and you play the man instead of the game, all is lost. Getting personal and hurling abuse and insults will only drive people away from you. You will only get abuse straight back, many times over. The information you seek and the debate you wish to engage in will dry up and not be forthcoming.

Take time to reflect – what do you actually want?



I quote from your previous posting on this forum -

“To all that felt they were offended, my apologies.

__________________
Pieter J de Villiers”

Does this include me?

Kind regards,

Chris

[junglegeorge12]

"If this people disrespect you, why be nice to them?"-Pieter

Because that is what seperates men from boys, us from animals, and the honorable from the worthless. Why do you have to become what others tempt you to be?- is the better question.

[Lee B]

GENTLEMEN! GENTLEMEN! You are in immediate danger of repeating the transgression of forgetting that this is a KOI board.

Please take politics and petty personality conflicts elsewhere, or at least confine them to PM's or e-mails.

[luke frisbee]

Quote: Originally Posted by Valarc I think you just hit the nail on the head, Larry. The people STARTING these ridiculous arguments are NOT the kind of people who respect Brian or Koi-Bito. But, as soon as one of these rants is posted, there are always going to be respectful members (like JR) who won't just sit by and let such trash go unanswered. When you see personal attacks, the unfortunate truth is, it's human nature to attack back. I tend to be one of the folks who isn't very good at biting his tongue, so I've been in the middle of this crap more times than I like to admit to. This is one case where I'm in favor of heavy moderation - had the original political post been removed swiftly, the thread would have likely continued without the garbage, and we'd have a useful discussion instead of another thread dumped in "outside". I have no doubt that with the extensive user base of Koi Bito, Brian would be able to find some volunteer moderators who would be fair and do their best to keep the trash off the board. Koi Bito is beyond critical mass, and IMHO unless more active moderation is put in place, the quality of the forum is going to degrade quickly. You can't appeal to the sense of decency of a person who comes here solely to stir the pot.

let me see if i can find a post of Valarc's that sounds different than this

[luke frisbee]

(BRIAN, I hope this is proof enough that The Saint and His Sinners are carrying out coordinated attacks on members on this board. You may not even know all of the ones that are working with him (for him).
He wants it his way. he left Koivet and vowed to make them a non-entity and succeded by creating multiple internent personalities and along with cohorts went there and disrupted the board to the extent that most of the regular posters went elsewhere. When i went back and was making Koivet popular again he came there and with his buddies continued to harass me to the point that he influenced REC into banning me....and i am sure with hindsight REC can see that he was easily played. learn from REC's mistake. Koiphen and his money and its influence are a cancer here on your board.. unless the members of this board acknowledge how great StEphen is he will continue this action.
What ya gonna do? ban me again for trying to help ya see what is going on? if ya do I'll pull all my advertising and cancel my subscription (remember the child doing that? just one of many times he has shown to me what he is.)
Good luck with your decision and actions,
luke

this one: posted on Koiphen on November the 11

From KP by 'Valarc'...
...I came to this board in search of information, and am still gaining information from the board on a daily basis. One of the first conversations in which I was an active participant was the FIR discussion, one for which many people sent me much praise and encouraged me. Since that time, numerous people have been egging me on to "stir the pot" on other boards, sending me IMs to encourage me to reply to this post or that, and congratulating me when I get a good zing in against someone.

Now, I learn that I'm on the verge of being banned, because some don't like my attitude and I am too nasty to people. The whole REASON I'm nasty is because this very community has been encouraging me to do so since I first became vocal on this board. If you want me to back off and stop voicing my opinion when it's going to be a controversial one, I will happily do so - I enjoy being a part of this community and enjoy what I've learned from everyone. But please, if you want me to cool it here, stop encouraging me to start crap. It's not a switch I can just turn on and off for the people YOU don't like - if I'm encouraged to voice my opinion, I'm going to voice it on EVERYTHING, not just those things you agree with me on.

Now that I've been informed just how badly my nasty posts have been taken by some of the moderators, I will try to tone down my posts. But I won't just be toning them down here. If someone is trashing William on another board, if someone is talking about the koiphen cult, I won't be the one coming out to defend this board. Not because I don't believe it deserves defending, but because my attitude pisses off the mods here, mods who I respect and thank for their hard work. The same attitude that offends the republicans is the one that gives me the motivation to battle the anti-koiphen people. If I tone down the attitude, it gets toned down everywhere. It will probably be better for the hobby in general, but I'm sure quite a few factually incorrect and biased statements will now go unchallenged, as one of the few people who had the balls to stand up and say what he feels is right has decided to step down and let someone else handle it.

I'm sorry to the mods for disrespecting them, and I'm sorry to the board for the crap I've stirred up. I respectfully request that anyone and everyone who's been sending me IMs encouraging me to start crap with people stop doing so - I have enough trouble biting my tongue without ya'll egging me on. After all, it shouldn't be about the fight - it's all about the hobby.

James

[joe bauer]

mr. height, i don't know you, and i have never met you, but i think you should do a few things. first of all, ask yourself why you just made the post you made, then talk to some friends about it, then ask your doctor if he feels your behavior is normal and healthy.

[luke frisbee]

Quote: Originally Posted by steve height "Take a lesson from Deadwood " Newt 4 Guests, 2 Users - No thanks nfm Luke, joe bauer

the 4 guest are guests because the Saint comes by and checks to make sure all his flock are not speaking freely

[Valarc]

Luke, you are a hypocrite. I could show PMs from you encouraging me to attack people too. Anyone can go read the garbage you post on Newt's and know that your goal and the goal of most of the vocal people on that board is to try to do anything you can to screw with anyone who posts on Stephen's board or even thinks he's an OK guy. You are all desperately obsessed and it's sad.

I've disagreed with Stephen, and I've agreed with him. I've butted heads with him and I've been on the same side of arguments as him. And you know what? I still like him. Even if he banned me from koiphen, I wouldn't run off to your childish little board and obsess about him - photoshopping pictures and all the other idiotic crap you people do. Sit here and rant all you want about Stephen's crusade, and him "stepping on his *****", it's plainly obvious to anyone with the stomach to read that trash heap that you and your ilk are the ones with the axe to grind.

[luke frisbee]

brian,
all the ProKP posters are doing so because of their king'$ influence. All those that do not appreciate KP do not because we have good reason.
many of us came here and posted as normal hobbyists, but when KP gathers his troops and launches these attacks the thread goes in the gutter..it isn't until KP'ers come around. many people that know KP for what it really is post here for months on end without this crap...ONLY when the Saint decides to do this does it happen.

[luke frisbee]

Brian,
At least Valarc isn't trying to deny it.