Shusui for Comment

[koilvr]

approx 37 cm.
the aka/hi color along the base of the dorsal line, is this considered a fault?
thanks.

[koiczar]

Nice Shusui!! No, I don't believe that is a fault. If you look at Asagi and Shusui, the finnage should have a red base or motoaka in the fins. One of the most important things on a shusui is the scalation down the dorsal line. Yours looks fine until it gets about mid-way along the dorsal fin. But, other than that it looks very nice. Very clean white head too!!

[dick benbow]

This is a very nice shusui! Most standards look for uniformity.....if red on gills, ok as both seem to match. If red in pecs need to be on both sides, the red saddles
would do well if they matched but that is minor. The scalation, body shape, and clean face says alot about this koi as worthwhile. keep it well!

[koilvr]

Thanks koiczar & dick for your kind comments . I have passed this fish to my friend and he is putting this fish into a mud pond. Let's see how it goes in a few months time.

cheers.

[schildkoi]

Some of the "nice" aspects have been mentioned...balanced Motoaka, clean head, and nice blue ground. But, I hope one can also appreciate defining the Koi to a particular standard, or "ideal". The "zippering of the Doitsu scales is uneven as it gets to mid dorsal and lacking at the tail joint. In addition, the lack of uniformity in the beni from side to side (symetrical) is a distraction.

Nice Koi and could do well, depending on the competition of the day.

Steve

[koilvr]

Thanks Steve for your kind comments.

That's new information to me. In selecting a Shusui, as far as symmetry is concern so far I focus more on the zipper, pectoral/motoaka and head pattern (and it's already difficult enough to find one with reasonable symmetry in this 3 elements, especially if you are low on budget ). Now I know that symmetry in body pattern/saddle is also a point to look at. Thanks .

Can I say that symmetry in Shusui = balance pattern in Gosanke? Which means in judging a shusui, this symmetry/balance comes 3rd after body conformation and skin quality (in Shusui? is it clean white head? quality of hi? blue/white ground?)

cheers
rudy

[schildkoi]

In gosanke, "balance" can be "asymetrical" while in a shusui, you are actually looking for actual "symetry". Clear as mud, huh?

Steve

[koilvr]

Yes Steve, clear as mud

Anyway, in a koi show, when it comes to gosanke, what I understand is that the judges will go for 1st body conformation, 2nd skin quality, then 3rd balance pattern. Assuming there are 2 fishes with same body conformation, the one with better skin quality will win even if it's pattern is less balance than the other one (pls correct me if I'm wrong here )

Now, if it is a shusui and not gosanke, when 2 fishes has the same body conformation, and 1 fishes has excellent symmetry (zipper, head/body pattern, motoaka) but so so skin quality while the other one has excellent skin quality but less than perfect symmetry, which one is generally win? Bottom line, do koi show judge Shusui the same with Gosanke ?

thanks

[schildkoi]

Talkign about the Gosnale "skin" verses "pattern" that is. You forget to mention "color", often included under "quality". Depth of color in Gosanke is VERY important, 3 coats of paint verses 1 coat as an example. Then when you start drawing comparisons between only 2 elements, are they wieghted equally or not? and then, at what level within a "scale" do each fall and then to wieght them accordingly....becomes mind bogling when approached from a "statistical analysis" methodology. Judges spend countless hours studying traits and putting them together in an attempt to judge the OVERALL IMPRESSION of the Koi verses attempting to approach from an almost impossible task of "grading" based on statistical analysis. That is why you may hear people talk about "training one's eyes". This allows for taking the overall impression based on the given traits and taking a more wholistic approach towards judging.

More "Mud", right?

Now for Shusui, being doitsu, the "paint" is only a single coat and should have Crisp edging and even tone throughout. This will lead to a better overall "impression". The degree to which any attribute may not be perfect is wieghted against each other in that overall impression. Would I prefer even color tone and sharp edges over symetry? Yes, to a point since depending on the degree against "perfect" that its falls away from the standard, will determine the overall "impression".


Even more mud, right?

[koilvr]

Indeed, more mud But I think I can see the light at the end of the muddy water "Overall Impression" should be the keyword, you just have to see the fish as a whole.

Thanks a lot Steve.