"Jumbo" Tosai

[reptar15]

I also encountered a similar situation where the koi importer was shady about the origins of the koi. the dealer gave me a huge list of POSSIBLE breeders the koi could have came from and he actually told me for a koi at 6" it didn't matter... imo that is ridiculous, the guy expected me to shell out $200 for a 6' fish without giving me a definite origin.

[gypsymom]

Sounds like it could be the same person.

I don't want to 'dis' this person by name. Just not a 'nice' thing to do. (A 'golden-rule' thing.)

I suspect quite a few have done business with this person. He's getting his money from somewhere.
Be it enough to say 'Himitsu'.

It may get back to him anyway, that there are more than a few that are on to his game.

Be kinder than you think necessary...for everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

[reptar15]

Quote: Originally Posted by gypsymom Sounds like it could be the same person. [/color][/center]

based on ur location prob not

[gypsymom]

Koi came from a few states away.

[luke frisbee]

so back to the koi...
MikeM,
Jumbos are not only from physiological make-up genes, behavior also causes koi to get big...a food fixatted koi will grow fast and big. I've had fish that were less than three inches at 18 months while their friendlier siblings were eating and growing fast. The small koi were given 3500 gallons for the 15 of them and they didn't want at any time for pellets or bloodworms, but many of them stayed tiny and at the bottom of the pond.

[danzcool]

Quote: Originally Posted by gypsymom Be it enough to say 'Himitsu'

It's his "secret."

I had another dealer explain the possible reasoning behind the secret, being that a certain type of carp with certain traits are fairly scarce in Japan. If he gives up his source, other dealers may use this breeder and end up making his supply dry up... or maybe his supply isn't really in Japan at all?

[gypsymom]

Luke,
We have had similar experiences.

Fish Daddy will take the time, after he has observed who has and hasn’t eaten really well, and deliberately dribble food to the poorer eaters. What has happened is, those fish are really starting to ‘shoot up.’ Fish Daddy swears that by doing this, the smaller guys gain ‘confidence’ during the ‘feeding frenzy’ and become more aggressive eaters, thus the faster growth.

My little goshiki is a prime example. When he moved into the big pond he isolated himself, was really shy and wasn’t eating very well. Now, 3 months later, when that food hits the water, I swear; he JUMPS over the big guys, eats his fill, rests and then come looking for that little something ‘extra’. He has gone from 9.5’ to 11-11.5’ in a very short time. And we still have MORE growing time to go this year.

Yes……'Fish Daddy'……and I’m 'Gypsymom', after the cat.)
What can I say?

[Clay]

I thought Toby just like PapaBear when I first read the thread title. One other comment. For marketing purposes a small Nisai can very easily become a jumbo tosai for the dumb American. This is why you want to do business with people that you trust and are up front.

Rick

[MikeM]

Luke: Some of those little ones may be true runts, but I'd guess it is more likely that they'd eat and grow if given their own space. Koi react peculiarly to the eating habits of pondmates. Guppies are so much more predictable!

[PapaBear]

"Jumbo Tosai" are marketed to the IMPATIENT novice at a premium price. Experience often comes at a premium price, even if it is a bad experience.
As to "Premium Priced Imports" from anonymous sources... Bu!!$&!#. A legitimate dealer of import Koi asking a pedegree price will be MORE than happy to BOAST about the breeder and his reputaion. The only Japanese imports I've seen where the origin could not be specified were mixed groups of small tosai bulk purchased and selling for $25-$35 price range.