Costia, Trichondella, and Chichondia? VS. NaCl

[lildude]

I was wondering if salt, or a salt bath has any effect what so ever on an infected koi. Some of my koi are flashing, and I intend to fix it, but I have been very short on time lately, well all the time. Due to the schedule the court has ordered since my parents divorced when I was 4. Well anyways, My koi are starting to flash, and this isnt just iching or something that koi do like humans. Something is irritating them, I did some research and found that acriflavine, potassium permaganate, Malachite green, and one i cant remember are all effective to atleast one of the parasites listed in the title.

Well does salt, and salt baths do anything to these horrible parasites?

[dizzyfish]

If the koi are flashing you may have flukes. You really need to have someone look at scrapings under a microscope. Salt is pretty ineffective against flukes in my experience. PP is more effective, but also more dangerous so diligence is needed in handling and dosing.
Mitch

[lildude]

Quote: Originally Posted by dizzyfish If the koi are flashing you may have flukes. You really need to have someone look at scrapings under a microscope. Salt is pretty ineffective against flukes in my experience. PP is more effective, but also more dangerous so diligence is needed in handling and dosing. Mitch

Maybe, but one of my fish, I think magoi, has developed a white mucus film layer on it.
So I have to first assume that they are not flukes until I can get scrapings done.

[MikeM]

lil: Flukes can lead to the extra mucous. You may well have several things going on at once. If you do not have a microscope available, see if there is a Koi Health Advisor near you. Check the AKCA website for clubs in your area. For most microscopic parasites that affect koi, ProForm-C is effective as long as temps not too cool. But, for flukes the current favored treatments are supaverm and prazi. (I know folks who still prefer Fluke-tabs.) Without using a scope, you can treat for the wrong thing or you treat for more than is involved, wasting money and exposing the fish to these medications unnecessarily.

You've been asking lots of questions. I suggest you get a good book on koi and read it cover to cover. Koi Kichi may be a bit pricey for you, but check if it is in the public library in your town. If not, there will be others. Focus on ones published since 2000.

[saratogatan]

L,
excessive muchus and flashing, maybe fluke, only a microscope will tell. The quick checklist :

- large % water change lately ?
- change in water quality ?

if you want to shotgun whatever is bugging your koi, I will say QQQQQuick-Cure + fenbendazole. QC runs $60 in a few places, and still work in Norcal today, and for the next few days, fenbendazole runs $90 for 300g, doze it @2ppm. The protocol, calculate you pond volume, covert it to L, then gram of fenben, give it 10% extra. So, for 7500g pond, you are looking at 60 g fenbendazole.

How to do this the easy way :
find a plastic container with cap, put on kitchen glove fill with about 1" of water, in goes fenben, then QC. fasten cap. hold and submerge the container in you pond, shake the hell out of it for about 10 minutes, pour the mixture into you pond. No water change for 10 days, but 7 days is usually enough.

WHere to get fenben :

4 fish stuff dot com.

hope that help.

stan

[D@z]

Do not put anything in there until you know what the problem is. Jeez!! you cant treat what you dont know. It could be any one of a hundred different reasons, people should not be advising simply throwing chemicals into your pond until you know what you are treating for.

Check all your parameters, check them again. Get your microscope out and take several scrapes (at least one gill scrape and 2 other areas) from several fish. Determine EXACTLY what problem you have and then look into the best treatment to cure that problem. Dose exactly as stated on the chemical (if it comes to chemicals) and follow any other instructions exactly.

[lildude]

Quote: Originally Posted by D@z Do not put anything in there until you know what the problem is. Jeez!! you cant treat what you dont know. It could be any one of a hundred different reasons, people should not be advising simply throwing chemicals into your pond until you know what you are treating for. Check all your parameters, check them again. Get your microscope out and take several scrapes (at least one gill scrape and 2 other areas) from several fish. Determine EXACTLY what problem you have and then look into the best treatment to cure that problem. Dose exactly as stated on the chemical (if it comes to chemicals) and follow any other instructions exactly.

I know how to scrape, anestethize, look in microscope, the only reason why I have'nt is I am not at my dad's house all of the time. I need to get my own bloody microscope though, I hate using other peoples.

I just hate seeing my fish sick, but what needs to be done, needs to be done.
I need to treat them, and thats what I'll do.

[keokoi]

I know how to scrape, anestethize, look in microscope, the only reason why I have'nt is I am not at my dad's house all of the time. I need to get my own bloody microscope though, I hate using other peoples.

Good your halfway there then. Scrape in scope the fish and you will target the problem. Rather than adding a capful of this and that.

I just hate seeing my fish sick, but what needs to be done, needs to be done.
What needs to be done is exaclty what D@z says. Minimize your errors by correcting the problem first hand.

I need to treat them, and thats what I'll do.

The million dollar questions is treat then for WHAT?

The book koikichi that Bob Winkler gave you is a powerhouse of info. The tuff part is the book doesn't do it for you. Googling and reading doesn't give you the hand on that you so very very need.

Joe

[lildude]

Quote: Originally Posted by keokoi I know how to scrape, anestethize, look in microscope, the only reason why I have'nt is I am not at my dad's house all of the time. I need to get my own bloody microscope though, I hate using other peoples. Good your halfway there then. Scrape in scope the fish and you will target the problem. Rather than adding a capful of this and that. I just hate seeing my fish sick, but what needs to be done, needs to be done. What needs to be done is exaclty what D@z says. Minimize your errors by correcting the problem first hand. I need to treat them, and thats what I'll do. The million dollar questions is treat then for WHAT? The book koikichi that Bob Winkler gave you is a powerhouse of info. The tuff part is the book doesn't do it for you. Googling and reading doesn't give you the hand on that you so very very need. Joe

Yes, Koi kichi is a powerhouse. I copied all the parasitic and viral diseases into my notebook, I know they will come in handy. I also copied down the map of ojiya, plus the key to it all. I am finally getting a chance to organize the things I know, and am learning.

Yes, what to treat with? I will have to see about treating this weekend.

[danzcool]

You know lil, you have a list of people in your sig that are your "inspiration". I guarantee you , those people would scrape and scope to find out what to treat for before throwing chemicals at the fish and hoping for the best. Here is your chance to prove that you are actually learning something.