Who has the most GC trophies?

[dizzyfish]

JR check with Waddy on the Doitsu Sanke. He says it was the very first All Japan Champion in Kio2Kichi. p. 37
Mitch

[JasPR]

Ha! Well THAT is pretty embarrassing considering I WROTE a chapter in THAT book!! LOls

So there is the fish Ray posted once again. Makes Glenn Takeshita's book look questionable based on the number of sources representing the 'other' champion fish. I'd love to here Glenn's comments on this. Anyone know him and if he is still alive? He lived in Hawaii at the time ( 1970s) JR

[RayJordan]

JR,
I understand and appreciate your comments about trying to nail down the "correct" data and photos for the grand champions of the AJS ZNA and Shinkokai shows. No doubt some is translation issues. One example is that in some articles and book a particular koi is shown and a caption says something like " 5th All Japan show Grand Champion sanke. There are many possibilities.

#1 Not clear which All Japan show they refer (there are 3 or even 4 depending on year)
#2 Was it the grand Champion of the entire show or the Grand Champion of the Sanke's (what we would call best in class)
#3 or was it Grand Champion of a group (what we would call Adult or Mature Champion)
#4 or did they get the show # wrong
#5 or did they get the year wrong
#6 Maybe it was just incorrect info, etc. etc.

I could add many more if you add in trying to identify the names of breeder or the owner.

ps I am going to start a seperate thread for this since it has gone off the orginal topic.

[aquitori]

Was wondering if Ray could add anything more to the koi history 101 buffs like us here on the board and we can:
add one more SoCal GC to Joe Co's list of accomplishments.

and 3 more GC titles for Carolyn Swanson...

[cocoyboy]

Quote: Originally Posted by Nancy M. We have 5 Grand Champions with 1 showa, and 4 Grand champions with 1 Kohaku.

To win with one fish over and over again is a great achievment to me because you actually condition and grow that fish yourself. I mean instead of buying a fish to win at a show. I admit, I do it too sometimes! I only can imagine keeping larger koi conditioned to win that many times requires a fair amount of attention. I'm just in the small fish category.

[koibooi]

One of the articles I wrote for our local publications. Maybe you can introduce a USA KOI Grand Slam:

The South African Koi Grand Slam

For the keen golfers in our Koi industry, the words “Grand Slam” means a lot. Achieving the Grand Slam is a privilege only a selected few of the top competitors in the world have ever achieved. For those non-golfers in our Koi industry you will have no idea what I am talking about so let me explain --- Every year there are many golf tournaments that are played in many countries around the world with a lot of prestige and a trophy going to the winner of each competition (not to mention the prize money). There are however four specific golf tournaments in the world, known as the “four Majors”, that are set aside as being more equal than the rest. At these tournaments the competition is more difficult, the conditions are more challenging and a winner at any one of these four tournaments will proudly be known as “a Champion”, keenly defending his title a year later. If a golfer can win ALL FOUR of these major competitions in one calendar year then his name goes down in history as a “Grand Slam Champion”.

Why am I carrying on about golf if this is a Koi magazine – Well in South Africa we also now have four Koi “Majors” each and every one a very prestigious Koi show. In addition to some smaller shows and competitions, there is the George Show, the Johannesburg Show, the Cape Town show and the National which will be held in Durban this year. To take the Supreme Grand Champion trophy home at any one of these shows is quite an accomplishment as the competition is getting stronger each year. Better water keeping techniques, improved food quality, better understanding of fish health and an increasing access to high quality Koi are all factors that are pushing up the standards of Koi keeping and showing in South Africa.

To date participation in competitions has been fairly localized with most Koi keepers participating in shows in their own geographical region and only a few traveling to enter Koi in other geographies. Some of the factors that have been a hindrance are the costs associated with transporting fish, potential stress and damage in taking fish to shows and the fact that we have to travel fairly long distances to get to the four “major” shows. Another factor to consider is how close the dates are to one another for the various shows and whether a fish will have enough time to recover fully before a next show.

I do not think that these factors are insurmountable and I would like to put the notion of the South African Koi Grand Slam up for discussion. Maybe there is even somebody out there who would put up a cash prize or special trophy for the winner of the Grand Slam. This will entail taking the Supreme Grand Champion trophy at each of the four major SA Koi shows within a 12 month period. To make the time frame a bit more flexible the rules can state that the Grand Slam winner must hold the Supreme Grand Champion trophy of all four major shows within a 12 month period, not necessarily within a calendar year. A mini-grand-slam would be if at some shows one holds the Supreme Grand Champion trophy and at other shows you hold the Reserve Grand Champion trophy within a 12 month period.

There are a few of permutations of the above but overall the idea is to encourage more national competition and expand the interest in our wonderful hobby that is called – Koi. Now how about that for being KoiKichi.


Supreme Grand Champion - Cape Town Koi show 2006
Reserve Grand Champion - Cape Town Koi show 2006
Supreme Grand Champion – George Koi show 2007
Reserve Grand Champion – George Koi show 2007
Supreme Grand Champion – Cape Town Koi show 2007
Reserve Grand Champion – Cape Town Koi show 2007

[mstrseed]

Carsten Pedersen at this years TKFGS show took:

Grand Champion Koi
Grand Champion Longfin
Grand Champion Goldfish

Sounds Like a slam to me...........

[JasPR]

I'd say Joe Co in the USA and certainly Bill Oakley in the UK. Although the late Joe wilmington had a streak going for a while. But the Brits won a National show. So I think you have to take the venue into account. Local vs National. And in the USA, regional vs local. And as I mentioned to Jeff S in another post, USA shows vary greatly in clubs sophistication, member's eyes and number of entries. So some shows are easier to win than others. It's always about the competition of the day but historically some shows always bring out higher competition at the GC level with three to six possible winners competing for GC.

The concept of ZNA judging and posting of photos in Nichirin was to demonstrate how clubs move forward in the area of koi appreciation as a chapter of the organization. Indeed in the old days, the Japanese ZNA judge would lecture to the membership at the awards banquet about what the group was doing well at and what needed improvement. This approach was considered 'politically incorrect' by many members who felt 'talked down to and insulted by suggestions regarding improved husbandry technique' so the practiced was abandoned in favor of a softer version in which the winners were prasied for their accomplishments. A subtle change but a different approach.
JR

[PapaBear]

Quote: Originally Posted by mstrseed Carsten Pedersen at this years TKFGS show took: Grand Champion Koi Grand Champion Longfin Grand Champion Goldfish Sounds Like a slam to me...........

More like winning Gold in a Triathalon

[Super Kindai]

Quote: Originally Posted by JasPR Thanks Jim. And thanks Brian for translating. So the official text shows that Ray posted a fish that was indeed a 'champion'. But it doesn't say Grand Champion? And Glenn Takeshita must have done his homework to have the confidence to put the picture of 'his' sanke GC in a printed publication. On the other hand, we all know how inaccurate TFH publications are in general when it comes to koi information! So the mystery continues--- JR The winner of the first All Japan Combined show that took place in the fall of 1968 in Tokyo was----------??????

Yes, it seems like the Doitu Sanke was GC...
http://www.echigo.ne.jp/~koi/zen/show00.html