What have I done now? Help! A horror story.

[UP ALL NIGHT!!]

Hi,
5000 gal. pond 13 years old.
New bio filter PSP 24" Top Mount (Emperor Aquatics.)
Microbe lift PL to seed filter.

Two days later, first thing in the morning I went out to say good morning to my kids. All of my koi are on the bottom of the pond. (I ran in to the house screaming "My baby's, My Baby's!!!!" Their fins are gone!!!!")
I absolutely Freaked out. (Clamped fins.)
Ammonia and nitrites up the roof PH OK.

I was on the phone and Internet trying to find help. Everyone had a different opinion.
All I could think was they might die!!! Live terrible life with burnt up gills. Shredded fins and damaged eyes.

I was concerned about using all these different chemicals.
I was so confused...
I ended up changing water, and changing water, and changing more water. It was like the ammonia got stuck and would not budge? Used amquel plus ($400 worth.)
Ammonia 2.0 Nitrite over 2.0 PH 7.8 alkalinity was low ppm.
When It hit this point I had to remove the fish. 9:00 pm. Again I freaked.
My fish have more than doubled in size the the 20 months I've had them.
I did not have enough large bins to put them in. I freaked.
Ran to Target and bought a 2000 gal. swimming pool.

Filled it, moved the hakko 80L and disk diffuser from the pond. Added amquel plus, salt and let it "rest" over night. Next morning I drained the pond enough so I could safely remove the koi and place them in the pool (All but 12 ".)
Friday I went to Blue Ribbon Koi. John helped allot.
told me to increase TA 100-120ppm. Bought test kits, more amquel plus and Johns secret weapon K.I. Nitrifer. Got home and put some in.
Next morning I tested and the ammonia was GONE. But the nitrites shot up. SUNDAY morning when I tested Ammonia is gone and the nitrites were lower .25-.50.

Monday I was able to get some sleep I have been up all day and night for 78 hours. I did sneak in a two hour nap. Ammonia great and nitrite holding steady. All was starting to look good till today. My Ph has shot up to 9.0 with the fish and 9.3 with the pond.

My fish and I cant take any more.........

P.S. Another stupid thing I did when the ammonia lowered to 0 in the pond I was having a pool ammonia crises. The only thing I could do was slowly circulate water from pond to pool then pool to pond. So far it is working great. Koi seem quite happy. I am afraid to put them back in the pond in case of another freak out.
My koi's are all quality they may not be show but I did get some nice ones. They are my children.
I can't loose any of them.
Looking at this I see all of the mistakes I have made I am here to learn. Lori

[Russell Peters]

Quote: Originally Posted by UP ALL NIGHT!! Hi, 5000 gal. pond 13 years old. New bio filter PSP 24" Top Mount (Emperor Aquatics.) Microbe lift PL to seed filter. Two days later, first thing in the morning I went out to say good morning to my kids. All of my koi are on the bottom of the pond. (I ran in to the house screaming "My baby's, My Baby's!!!!" Their fins are gone!!!!") I absolutely Freaked out. (Clamped fins.) Ammonia and nitrites up the roof PH OK. I was on the phone and Internet trying to find help. Everyone had a different opinion. All I could think was they might die!!! Live terrible life with burnt up gills. Shredded fins and damaged eyes. I was concerned about using all these different chemicals. I was so confused... I ended up changing water, and changing water, and changing more water. It was like the ammonia got stuck and would not budge? Used amquel plus ($400 worth.) Ammonia 2.0 Nitrite over 2.0 PH 7.8 alkalinity was low ppm. When It hit this point I had to remove the fish. 9:00 pm. Again I freaked. My fish have more than doubled in size the the 20 months I've had them. I did not have enough large bins to put them in. I freaked. Ran to Target and bought a 2000 gal. swimming pool. Filled it, moved the hakko 80L and disk diffuser from the pond. Added amquel plus, salt and let it "rest" over night. Next morning I drained the pond enough so I could safely remove the koi and place them in the pool (All but 12 ".) Friday I went to Blue Ribbon Koi. John helped allot. told me to increase TA 100-120ppm. Bought test kits, more amquel plus and Johns secret weapon K.I. Nitrifer. Got home and put some in. Next morning I tested and the ammonia was GONE. But the nitrites shot up. SUNDAY morning when I tested Ammonia is gone and the nitrites were lower .25-.50. Monday I was able to get some sleep I have been up all day and night for 78 hours. I did sneak in a two hour nap. Ammonia great and nitrite holding steady. All was starting to look good till today. My Ph has shot up to 9.0 with the fish and 9.3 with the pond. My fish and I cant take any more......... P.S. Another stupid thing I did when the ammonia lowered to 0 in the pond I was having a pool ammonia crises. The only thing I could do was slowly circulate water from pond to pool then pool to pond. So far it is working great. Koi seem quite happy. I am afraid to put them back in the pond in case of another freak out. My koi's are all quality they may not be show but I did get some nice ones. They are my children. I can't loose any of them. Looking at this I see all of the mistakes I have made I am here to learn. Lori

Now I know how you came up with your screen name. I am sorry you had to go through so much.

What I don't understand is that you say your pond is 13 years old. If it is that old, and you have had your Koi for 20 months, why would you have so much ammonia so suddenly? When you put on your knew filter, did you have an old filter that you got rid of?

[MCA]

whatever you do....don't feed the fish for weeks....

[UP ALL NIGHT!!]

I left the water ruining when I filled the pond...

I lost all but one.

After that I seriously thought about filling in the pond.

I built it myself. Dug it out, laid the footing, set the blocks, stucco and liner. Cut and fitted the flagstone all for a thousand dollars. Young and poor in those days. All of my original koi came from a breeder who made yearly trips to sell koi in Thurmont, Maryland and else where in the states. I can't remember the name some hot shot with very nice koi. I paid $300.00-$600.00 for 6" baby's. All the larger koi were in the thousands.
I would make the pilgrimage in the wee hours to get there first. Get a number and sleep in the car first come first served. It was allot harder to get nice koi 12-15 years ago With out spending lots of $$$. I bought a couple every year. Everyone wanted the little ones (less expensive) so they went first.

When I murdered my baby's (I could not remove their body's from the pond I had my husband do it.) I will never be the same.

Then I was very bad and bought $4400 in new fish 6-9" What a surprise my husband had when I sneak back from BWI (airport)with three boxes of koi.
(I took the money out of savings to buy the fish.) BOY WAS HE MAD. He just doesn't get it.

Now my pond is getting tired the weir has started leaking. My new fish 15 + one survivor of. They are now 12" to 18".

I finally demanded to my husband that I had to have a new filter. My old one is a home made with bio ball as medium. It couldn't handle the fish load.

My new filter is rated at 15,000 gal. by the manufacture. But where I bought said they rate it for 10,000 gal. I bought this one with the thought of my new pond I will have built in a year or two.

Please advise me. Thank You All, Lori

[Nancy M.]

Quote: Originally Posted by UP ALL NIGHT!! Hi, 5000 gal. pond 13 years old. New bio filter PSP 24" Top Mount (Emperor Aquatics.) Microbe lift PL to seed filter. Hi Lori Is the new bio filter your only filter? if so this is part of your problem. DONT feed your fish any food for a week or two. Your filter can not keep up with your fish load, it needs to cycle. Two days later, first thing in the morning I went out to say good morning to my kids. All of my koi are on the bottom of the pond. (I ran in to the house screaming "My baby's, My Baby's!!!!" Their fins are gone!!!!") I absolutely Freaked out. (Clamped fins.) Ammonia and nitrites up the roof PH OK. I was on the phone and Internet trying to find help. Everyone had a different opinion. All I could think was they might die!!! Live terrible life with burnt up gills. Shredded fins and damaged eyes. I was concerned about using all these different chemicals. I was so confused... I ended up changing water, and changing water, and changing more water. It was like the ammonia got stuck and would not budge? Used amquel plus ($400 worth.) When using amquel plus and testing your water what test kit are you using? Water changes are a great way to help control the ammonia and ph. Ammonia 2.0 Nitrite over 2.0 PH 7.8 alkalinity was low ppm. When It hit this point I had to remove the fish. 9:00 pm. Aga in I freaked. My fish have more than doubled in size the the 20 months I've had them. I did not have enough large bins to put them in. I freaked. Ran to Target and bought a 2000 gal. swimming pool. Filled it, moved the hakko 80L and disk diffuser from the pond. Added amquel plus, salt and let it "rest" over night. Next morning I drained the pond enough so I could safely remove the koi and place them in the pool (All but 12 ".) Friday I went to Blue Ribbon Koi. John helped allot. told me to increase TA 100-120ppm. Bought test kits, more amquel plus and Johns secret weapon K.I. Nitrifer. Got home and put some in. Next morning I tested and the ammonia was GONE. But the nitrites shot up. SUNDAY morning when I tested Ammonia is gone and the nitrites were lower .25-.50. Monday I was able to get some sleep I have been up all day and night for 78 hours. I did sneak in a two hour nap. Ammonia great and nitrite holding steady. All was starting to look good till today. My Ph has shot up to 9.0 with the fish and 9.3 with the pond. Keep doing the water changes, do you have a overflow on your pond? If so you could have a constant drip going into pond of fresh water, this will also help. My fish and I cant take any more......... P.S. Another stupid thing I did when the ammonia lowered to 0 in the pond I was having a pool ammonia crises. The only thing I could do was slowly circulate water from pond to pool then pool to pond. So far it is working great. Koi seem quite happy. I am afraid to put them back in the pond in case of another freak out. My koi's are all quality they may not be show but I did get some nice ones. They are my children. I can't loose any of them. Looking at this I see all of the mistakes I have made I am here to learn. Lori Do you have an old filter and pump that you could hook up to the swimming pool? you could lessen the burden on the pool and the pond, if you could split the fish load between them. Remember dont feed and keep up the water changes. Both systems will take time to kick in.

Please keep us posted

[aquitori]

New pond/water syndrome, bugs in a bottle dont really do much to a "cleaned system".

I think that person needs to contact JNorth who in turn can contact ZNA Potomac KHA...

[velvetbone]

Up All Night,
I am very sorry to hear about your predicament.
I see that you've only had 2 posts. So you maybe new to this forum or maybe you've been a "lurker".
In either case you can feel like you're not alone. I am very much a newbe, but I can honestly say that the people who post on this site know what they are talking about and are Very Genuine.
They feel just like you do about their Koi.
They may qualify as Koi Kichi but, when it comes to this hobby I am finding out that Koi Kichi is a good thing.
I will say an extra prayer for you tonight!! Please keep us posted.
Vince

[Bob Winkler]

I feel your pain. Hang in there It will get better..You have had some very good suggestions to help.

[KoiCop]

Hi Lori . . .

IMHO you can save quite a bit of money by using the dry versions of regular Amquel or ClorAm-X (two different brand names for the same product).

Furthermore, these products do not remove ammonia from the pond but they do chemically bind it up so that it's no longer harmful to the fish. And if you're using the 'wrong' test kit you might still be 'reading' the bound ammonia (which is no longer harmful); so then it seems like the AQ isn't working when in fact it has. As a result, you pour in more and more AQ trying to drop the reading to zero -- which aint' never gonna happen. Get it?

Finally, not only does the AQ+ version cost more, it claims to do things which no hobbyist has ever been able to duplicate (like lowering nitrites & nitrates, etc.). Marketing hype, I'm afraid.

Good luck,

[Louie]

Hi,
I am surprised no one suggested you use salt until your water quaility is stable. It will help reduce stress and give you time to manage your water quality. .02 will be enough to calm things down .
Louie