Tategoi

[Redfrick]

I just picked up the new KN and had a few questions on the term tategoi.

1.Relative to pricing, are these fish deemed tategoi more expensive than say
Grade AAA or Show Quality?

2.I thought tategoi was a koi deemed not worthy for export, is this true?

3.What are some of the bench marks that breeders use to proclaim a fish tategoi?

Cheers,
Todd

[KoiCop]

From whats a tategoi??

At the very, very simplest level a tategoi is an unfinished koi with great potential.

The word is often misused; especially in marketing.

At its highest level, tategoi speaks to a breeder's vision. When a breeder looks at his koi's potential today and sees that the koi will continue to develop and get much, much better -- years and years down the road -- then that koi can be considered tategoi.

If tategoi, a breeder can charge today what it will be worth next year or the year after -- if he will even sell it, at all.

Very few tategoi ever leave Japan, and that's why most top hobbyists are so tight with use of that oft abused adjective.

Hey, did you see what JR posted this morning to your other thread re: use of the word tategoi? If you haven't, he said:

When asked if a baby fish is a tategoi, even that word will have two distinct meanings:

1) does the fish have a chance to improve based on what is seen today? Maybe for one more year? Or two more years? Remember, all tategoi are unfinished but not all unfinished fish are tategoi.

2) does the fish have ALL the elements present that suggest it will be tategoi for many years and then come together as a finished high grade koi at 76 cm?

[aquitori]

1.Relative to pricing, are these fish deemed tategoi more expensive than say
Grade AAA or Show Quality?

Usually these "Tategoi" labelled fish are a bit more expensive or usually not for sale. In general tategoi is a term used year to year after the growing season. A fish labelled tategoi one season doesn't generally mean it will be tategoi the next. There are some people that have spent alot of money on tategoi only for it to be sent back because it no longer was one in the breeders eyes.

2.I thought tategoi was a koi deemed not worthy for export, is this true?

The supposed true tategoi will be asked to stay in Japan, if the breeder feels that it is best interest of the fish. There's a difference between buying a breeder's "tategoi" at his retail shop than the ones kept in his secret "tategoi" greenhouses.

3.What are some of the bench marks that breeders use to proclaim a fish tategoi?

Bench marks would be overall quality, or the best of best of that years harvest. That is the bench mark of the breeders.

[MikeM]

You will find that the meaning differs from person to person. It should always include the idea that it is believed by the breeder that the fish will improve. For some, that is all it means. For others, it includes the idea that the improvement is more than mere finishing, but also moving toward a higher quality than is evident today. For me, there is also the idea that 'true tategoi' show high quality traits while retaining some of the unpredictability of youth at a more advanced age than the norm. That is, there is no assurance that all the factors will come together to produce a great koi, but all the factors discernible are positive for a great future. As time goes by, one trait or another shows that it will not reach the level anticipated. Then, it ceases to be tategoi.

[Brutuscz]

I always felt that a tategoi is a koi that will eventually be a successful show quality fish. I believe this is irrespective of the size in which it will peak. If you buy it at size one...and it is successful in competition at size two..then I think it was a tategoi to start with. I always keep in mind that any show winner, at any size, is probably 1 in 100,000 or maybe even a million. I never thought a tategoi had to be competitive for GC only...but had the qualities to be a winner somewhere along the way. I have come to the conclusion that the term is overused by dealers and underused by top hobbyists.