Help with fighting the toughest stain of ick I've seen

[Kristine]

Grant,
That fluke looks squished and growing algae. Was it moving? In between scrapings turn the light off to keep the bulb cool. Otherwise the heat from the light can kill them quickly. Also adding a drop of pond water on the glob of scraping will allow the bugs to move easier.

[gcuss]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kristine Grant, That fluke looks squished and growing algae. Was it moving? In between scrapings turn the light off to keep the bulb cool. Otherwise the heat from the light can kill them quickly. Also adding a drop of pond water on the glob of scraping will allow the bugs to move easier.

He was alive and kicking when first discovered. However, by the time my 6yr old and my 3 yr old had a look, then the wife, he had expired. There wasn't any algae on him. He managed to move over slightly to where there was some green on the slide.

Also, my microscope uses an LED light. No heat at all, I'm not sure if it's a good as the standard lights... but it seems plenty bright, without the heat. Another advantage, mine has 2 AA batteries inside and can run off those for hours seeing that an LED uses next to nothing for power. Kinda handy to go pondside with it.

Thanks for the input though. Anything to help me out with my new "jr science" kit is appreciated.

Grant

- here's his "before nutri-system" picture

[ReneeB]

I saw something moving!!!! It was this circle shaped thing that moved really quick, not in a circle thou, it was moving up the the left of the view area fairly quickly at X100. I could not catch it at X300. It almost looked liked it could flip or twist as it was moving.... It was pretty small.

I'll try to find one I can photograph.

[ReneeB]

I can't find them again I find stuff that looks like chilodinella, not moving. But the tiny thing I saw at X100 moved like the videos I've seen of trichodina. Would either of these produce white spots?

[JasPR]

Hi Renee, sorry you are having such a difficult time! Over time with practice you will get good at this- promise! You can even take samples of your filter mulm and get to see moving life under the scope! But for now I think I can just answer your direct questions. No chilodonella and trichodina and flukes do not cause those white spots. White spots are caused ( of that size) by carp pox, 'budding' anchor worms, some tiny wart like tumors and one encysted and rather rare parasite. The spots of ich usually tend to be smaller and very white in color. And if you can't see any under the scope it is unlikely that we are looking at ich.

All of this points out the real practical side of belonging to a 'live' koi club. In a case like this you could have local people to talk to and ask to come over to help with the microscope work. Not sure where you are, but I'd do a search on the AKCA site and see if there is an AKCA Koi Health person or a club in your immediate area. JR

[ReneeB]

Thanks for all your help! I'm going to look for someone who knows what they are doing. I don't want them to stop eating or get any worse. I'm about 2 hours south of Chicago.

These spots are VERY white. the look like small grains of white rice. No other color. The bump forms on occasion, and when it does, you can see a white spec in there.

I don't have a filter in, I'm just running the pump cuz of the quick cure. I'll stick with salt and quick cure until I find someone that can id this. Worse case, I teach part time at a community college, maybe someone there could help me find something on them.

Thanks again! I'll post whatever I find out.

[ReneeB]

my fish seem fine, but while calling around for help two people said i could kill my fish using quick cure and salt at 3teasp/gallon. I don't mean to ask you to repeat yourself, but is it ok if the water is at 82 degrees?

[ReneeB]

"Diagnosis of "Ich" is easily confirmed by microscopic examination of skin and gills. Remove several white spots from an infected fish, then mount them on a microscope slide with a few drops of water and a cover glass. The mature parasite is large, dark in color (due to the thick cilia covering the entire cell), and has a horseshoe-shaped nucleus which is sometimes visible under 100 x magnification"

This is from a site I found reading up about this "fun" stuff, do I have to remove a white spot and look at THAT under the microscope. I've only been using the slide cover down there side. If I have to remove a white spot, what is the best way to do that without hurting them. If I didn't like the personalities so much one these three, I'd ship it back to the breeder. I so hope I can get them better, the people on the phone today where not much help I'll find someone to take them too. We live in the middle of corn fields, most people around her plant gardens, may have a hosta or two, and a beta in a fish bowl.

[ReneeB]

The one at the bottom tore it's tail about a month ago, and it has been healing back. Those bumps are fuzzy like that, they are solid white circles. I don't want to stress the fish by taking a long time to pose.

[bekko]

The white spots caused by ich are about the size of a grain of salt and are easy to scrape off. Since you do not have ich, you do not need to scrape off the entire thing.

Use a cover slip, knife or scalpal to scrape off a little of the stuff and mash it between a slide and cover slip. Under the scope the cells will look overgrown and "frothy" if it's Lymphosistis. The cells will not be moving around.

I still think that what your fish need most is more space and better water.

-st e