The history of koi keeping in the USA.

[zek]

Those are nice memories refreshed every time you look at the pond.

My brother lived over there and sold the house so they could build the last runway.

[RayJordan]

Quote: Originally Posted by JasPR "I think that koi in Florida was a very small world and there were just a few players. I recall Ray Jordan mentioning something about his friend Megumi Yoshida and his early efforts to start a farm back in the 1970s? .. JR

Megumi told me he was hired out to work for Axelrod via Megumi's father to start a koi farm in Florida near Tampa After a lot of hard work preparing ponds and a basic breeding facility there was only a single season of breeding (1968) and culling. Megumi said that Axelrod never paid him or his father and he returned to Japan in 1969. I asked what happened to the koi or the facilities after he left but he didn't know.

[JasPR]

Thanks for that Ray. Tell me, what do you know of the ' history of koi in Texas'? I know Spindola helped Brett at one point. And that Ron Goforth brought ZNA to Texas. But is there earlier history ? ( Pre 1980?) JR

[lypope]

Burt Ballou is probably the best person in So Cal to talk to...I know that I saw koi in a backyard pond in West Los Angeles around 1968, and I remember going to teen Friday night dances at Japanese Village and feeding the koi in 1968-69. Burt can tell you the year that the first koi dealer (was it Asahi?) opened in Gardena - it was around the same timeframe.

[schildkoi]

There is no doubt that US Citizens of Japanese decent were done an injuctice (through internment camps) during WW II and that that act in retrospect was what some may consider unconstitutional. Times were different and with the "dishonorable act" of the attack on Pearl harbor, fears and speculations were high. Although these US citizens of Japanese decent were done an injustice, as a whole, an even bigger injustice was felt by them which was bestowed upon them by the Japanese government....the loss of honor in their homeland by the unconscionable act of that sneak attack on Pearl Harbor. Despite the injustice done by the US government, their patriotism for the US rose due to this act by their "homeland" (for lack of a better term).

Although as JR mentioned, there may still exist a predjudice for Americans by some in Japan, likewise those same predjudices that existed here have faded over the years. During the 1960s as a young boy my father had a distinct dislike for Japanese and any product labeled as "Made in Japan." We were not even allowed to have any of these types of products in our home. It wasn't until the 1980s (35 years post WW II) that Japanese items began "sneaking into his home." He now will only buy Honda automobiles...but still mentions that they are actually made in the US. Why such predjudice from my father? Being a Navy Corpsman attached to the Fourth Marine Division, he participated in the battles of Roi-Namur, Saipan, Tinian and Iwo Jime where he landed with a Marine riffle company of about 200 men. He was only 1 of 22 who walked off that island. Some memories never die.

To this day he has never accepted my love for Koi, knowing that it is a Japanese hobby. I still catch "flack" when I announce a trip to Japan.

Steve

[Dan Blatt]

Steve .....good post. While I also agree with the basic premise of injustice, one cannot compare the feelings or mood of the county after Pearl Harbor to today's standards.
Kind of like the monday morning quarterbacking regarding the use of the atom bombs on Nagasaki and Hiroshima. Any history buff familar with the battle at Iwo Jima probably realizes that the potential american loss of life from trying to unearth the japanese from the islands of Japan would have been devistating
My father was stationed in Yokohama after the war, where In attended kindergarden. We left when he was sent to Korea when the war broke out. I just wish I would have been older so I could have remembered more about the people and situation in Japan at that time.

[schildkoi]

Quote: Steve .....good post. While I also agree with the basic premise of injustice, one cannot compare the feelings or mood of the county after Pearl Harbor to today's standards. Kind of like the monday morning quarterbacking regarding the use of the atom bombs on Nagasaki and Hiroshima. Any history buff familar with the battle at Iwo Jima probably realizes that the potential american loss of life from trying to unearth the japanese from the islands of Japan would have been devistating

Dan, Thanks and I agree 100%. My point was that cultural standards change from generation to generation based upon the experiences of each. My dad has taken numerous trips to China but never to Japan. He would not even have a flight that is routed through Japan to China.

I on the otherhand have no desire to go to China but would jump at chances to go to Japan....go figure!

JR,
My first exposure to Koi was through a PBS documentary in the mid 80s about a Japanese koi breeder in California. I was enthrawled. It wasn't until about 8-10 years later (1994ish) that while on business in Sacremento (and already in the hobby) that I remembered this documentary and had a recolection that the koi farm in question was somewhere in that area. I searched and found Golden State Fisheries outside of Sacremento (Flourin I think?) and began visiting there. I was a nobody to the owner until about the 5th trip (a year and a half later) that this Japanese gentleman actually started talking to me conversationally. Fred Tonai (sp?) was that same Japanses gentleman who was featured in that documentary some 10-12 years earlier that first inspired me about koi. I wonder how long Fred and his business existed prior to the mid 80s when I first saw that documentary?

Steve

[KoiCCAPW]

Not everyone made a killing off of the internees.

I recall some stories of my grandfather, who lived in San Francisco at the time. If I got the story right, he had some good friends who were Japanese decent. When they had to go so fast that they couldn't get a good price for their property, he bought their place for a very small amount and took care of it while they were gone, and sold it back to them for the same small amount when they came back, so it wouldn't be lost. I think it was less than $100, but don't know the exact amount.

He felt very bad for them and didn't think it was right, but it was not a climate at the time in that people felt free to speak up about it. He was a local merchant and didn't want to anger customers, but he did what he felt he could do to help.

It's funny, to hear him talk you would have thought him very prejudiced from how he spoke, referred to all minorities by very non PC names that most wouldn't say in public anymore. But at the same time had many good friends of all races and never refused to sell to anyone.

My first exposure to koi was a drawing in a children's encyclopedia, World Book's Childcraft series from the early 1960's. In the volume on poetry there was a poem about a palace in china and the emperor's daughter,(I think, it's been a while!).

The picture was of the princess lounging by a pond and playing with the koi with her hand, and the koi splashing around her. I just loved that picture and never forgot it. The koi weren't nishikigoi, just red or black koi, but I still thought they were fascinating.

[RayJordan]

Quote: Originally Posted by JasPR Thanks for that Ray. Tell me, what do you know of the ' history of koi in Texas'? I know Spindola helped Brett at one point. And that Ron Goforth brought ZNA to Texas. But is there earlier history ? ( Pre 1980?) JR

Those are both good sources to go to.

I am assisting the Japanese Tea Garden koi pond restoration project with some koi /pond issues here in San Antonio. Looking at some pre-WWII. photos There were some type of carp and maybe even koi in the pond before the war. Wheather they were truely koi or not is hard to determine from old and poorly preserved B/W photos. There were definately koi in the pond from the mid 60's when color photos were made. The historical societies says that koi have been in the pond since before WWII. Maybe I can find out more at some point.
Japanese Tea Garden, San Antonio, Texas on Flickr - Photo Sharing!
Here is a link to the Garden History

[schildkoi]

Quote: Originally Posted by RayJordan Those are both good sources to go to. I am assisting the Japanese Tea Garden koi pond restoration project with some koi /pond issues here in San Antonio. Looking at some pre-WWII. photos There were some type of carp and maybe even koi in the pond before the war. Wheather they were truely koi or not is hard to determine from old and poorly preserved B/W photos. There were definately koi in the pond from the mid 60's when color photos were made. The historical societies says that koi have been in the pond since before WWII. Maybe I can find out more at some point. Japanese Tea Garden, San Antonio, Texas on Flickr - Photo Sharing! Here is a link to the Garden History

Ray,
Id you are referring to the Japanse sunken Gardens next to Brackenridge Park, I remember hearing that the landscaper of Japanese decent had koi in those gardens prior to WW II...but it has been 20 years and I may have that wrong. I remember taking the sky ride in Brackenridge Park and seeing the huge koi below in those gardens.....of course "huge" is relative but they sure seemed large back then (86 - 87 ish).

I'll see what I can dig up on that. Cheryl may know more as well since she grew up there..


Steve