Help!! Ammonia is killing my fish

[ootyboy]

I have been running my pond since the middle of April, which as some of you know, I recoated it with Poly and increased the filtration. My pond has been running since April 20th with about 10 fish -- with average length of about 10-12" each the pond.

I am having a heck of time cycling this pond. My Ammonia level has stayed consistently high -- around 1 PPM. I have been doing small water changes, 10-15% every other day and about 30% weekly to keep the Ammonia under control. As a side note my water billed has nearly doubled due to all the water changes!!

I have also been dosing with Cloramx to reduce the Ammonia level, which helps for a few days.

For some crazy reason this pond is not cycling!!! I have tried everything: Using water from an established pond, adding bacteria in the bottle -- but after 3 months I am reading high Ammonia with 0 Nitrite!!

I need help to understand and fix this problem. Here are the water details and my filtration details-- Please help!

6000 Gallons
1 WLim 36 Vortex Settlement Tank
1 WLim 36 Vortex Filter (Japanese Mat)
1 Ultima 10,000 pressure filter
80 Watt UV (has been turned off since I started the pond in April)
Rhino II bottom drain with an 80 Litre air pump

Water Readings
Ammonia -- 1.0 PPM to 1.5 PPM
Nitrite -- 0 PPM
PH -- 6.5

[gcuss]

Is there a chance your reagents are too old? Might be worth while trying a new test kit.

If that's not the case... does the chloramx or dechlor conflict with the test reagents you're using?

Grant

[MikeM]

Check for nitrate. If present, the ammonia test kit is likely giving a false reading.

[ootyboy]

The test kit is fine. That was another assumption that I had, so I went out and bought another one a couple of weeks ago. The readings did not change. I also have another pond, and the numbers there show 0 PPM for both Ammonia and Nitrite.

As for the Cloromax, I tested it with a tub of water from the pond. I tested the water first -- 1 PPM. I added a bunch of Clormax and it was down to 0 PPM. So I think the Cloromax is working.

I do not have a Nitrate test kit, only Nitrite. I will go out and get one. However, I am not sure what that will show.

[Kristine]

You might want to test the pH at a few different times and test the alkalinity level. If the pH crashed, your filter will not work. Bio-bacteria consumes alkalinity and can be replaced with water changes or crushed oyster shells. Although the low pH is safer for the ammonia levels but it should be watched at that level.

[ootyboy]

Kristine,

I have been testing the PH quite a bit (during AM and PM times, and on weekend in the middle of the day)..it has been hovering around 6.0 to 6.5.

To clarify what you are stating, do I need to increase the PH -- and if so to what number -- before bacteria will colonize?

I guess my first step is to get a Alkalanity test kit and to check that level before doing anything else.

[koiczar]

It would certainly help you to know what your Kh and Gh are. The Kh is the buffer for your Ph. What is the Ph from the water source? Yes, your bio filter can not become effective with a Ph of 6-6.5. I dealt with this problem with a customer before. His filter crashed and Ph was down to 5-5.5 yet his fish were doing fine with Ammonia readings in the 2.0-3.0 range. I recommended he get rid of his existing POS bead filter which was so clogged from not being cleaned properly, it was channeling. He started following my advice and then when he went to one of the local dealers here in the area, he was talking to the owner's wife (who knows less than nothing) and then the owner. They recommended something I had never heard of before, but it was suppose to raise the Ph. Well, he bought it, went home and immediately treated the pond. Within minutes, the fish were literally jumping out of the pond. It raised the Ph to 9.0 and allowed the Ammonia to become highly toxic and it was literally burning the fishes gill. He lost all his fish AND THEN CALLED TO TELL ME WHAT HAD HAPPENED. He wanted to sue the dealer. I was really POd too, but I told him, look, you asked for my advice and while you were following it, things were slowly getting better. Then you went behind my back and got some bad info based on less than accurate info you provided them, and you want to blame who? I'm very sorry for your loss but please don't ask for my advice again unless you're willing to follow it and only it!

The point here Ootyboy is, your system will not come on line with that Ph level. Kristine gave you the right advice, but YOU CANNOT BRING YOUR Ph UP ABOVE 7.0 WITH THAT LEVEL OF AMMONIA IN SINUE. Stop feeding, do some more water changes, oh, and test your source water for ammonia as well. You may be adding to the problem. If so, get a charcoal filter and run the water through it first. Get your ammonia level down to at most .5 and then start to raise the Ph. I really suspect your Kh to be the source of the problem here. You may have to add baking soda to help with that temporarily while you add oyster shell or Lithaqua to your system to help maintain the buffering capacity you need. In the meantime, can you move your fish to the other pond? If so, and your source water tests okay, you could drain it and start from scratch. Just a few suggestions. But keep this in mind - DON'T PUSH THE PANIC BUTTON AND START DOING EVERYTHING AT ONCE! Start with one thing at a time. This may take longer than you think, but addressing things individually will also allow you to learn what REALLY worked and what's required in the future should this happen again.

Mike

[CarolinaGirl]

Your pond can cycle with low pH....my pH is normally around 6.0 to 6.5 and it's been running for 3 years now. No ammonia, no nitrites.

[PapaBear]

Listen to Mike's solid advice.
Raising your ph too fast will make the ammonia toxic in a flash. Get a kh test kit and post some results on both your pond(s) and your source water. Move slow but smart.

[ootyboy]

Mike..thank you so much for your excellent advice. I think my plan of attack at this point is to first to step back and take a breather and not to rush into any major changes. Second, I will go out and get a KH and GH test kit and see the results. I will also test my source water and post those results as well.

Consequently, the reason I panicked about this issue, is that one of my favorite fish, a 22" Gin Rin Ochiba jumped out of the pond and died before I could get to him. So I do think the Ammonia is causing problems for the fish even at the lower PH levels.

I do have another small 800 gallon pond, which is currently being used as a quarantine for a few new fish that I recently acquired. For many reasons it would not be a good idea to move my fish from the larger pond to the small pond. Mainly, I don't want to expose them to any problems the new fish might have.

Interestingly, I use the same source water for the smaller pond. The readings on that pond have remained stable for the past few years.

Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
PH 7.5

Since I got the new fish, I have been doing daily 15% water changes on the small pond, with no adverse affect on the readings.

As for my source water it is testing @ .5 Ammonia level.

I will post the results of my test soon.

Thanks again for all the advice.