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Thread: Bob and Shila Winkler's Grow Out Form

  1. #21
    Oyagoi Bob Winkler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sangreaal View Post
    Got pics, Bob?

    Yep on the first page with the original pix... i thought it would be easier to see the progress with the pix together... Oh and I couldn't figure out how to post the same pic twice....

  2. #22
    Jumbo
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    I think........that' Usuri is a candidate of the competition........

  3. #23
    Oyagoi Bob Winkler's Avatar
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    Thank you for the kind comment Junichi That means much coming from you, no matter the final result of this friendly competition. And in that vein, I am encouraged for it's future as of now. We just went with a critical eye through our whole collection to cull out several koi to make room for this koi, and two others in the main pond. (Anybody want a 26" chagoi?) I am happy to say that this koi would have made the "cut" any way you slice it It also has the robust attitude I like for future growth, and eats consistently from my hand at 14" amongst the big girls.
    Best regards,

    Bob Winkler

    My opinions are my best interpretation of my experiences. They are not set in stone as I intend to always be a student of life. And Koi.


  4. #24
    Daihonmei PapaBear's Avatar
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    Looking very much like a "long journey" fish, which was a really good thing the last time I checked

    So tell us what you see in it beyond what the pictures show. What kind of trends have you seen in the body changes, skin, pattern shifts up and down, etc... The up close and personal time is so much more revealing than a photograph.

  5. #25
    Oyagoi Bob Winkler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaBear View Post
    Looking very much like a "long journey" fish, which was a really good thing the last time I checked

    So tell us what you see in it beyond what the pictures show. What kind of trends have you seen in the body changes, skin, pattern shifts up and down, etc... The up close and personal time is so much more revealing than a photograph.

    Hmmm... I am not one to "wax poetic" like some, but much more of a down and dirty straight to the point kind. Unless talking about koi Shila says, and then I can drone on for hours... Let's see what I've gotten so far out of this.

    I don't know nuttin' bout birthin' no babies, er...picking baby koi. Of this I am very clear. I had high hopes for the SU 107 that died right off, which I thought had all my best guesses for future wrapped up in it. With this koi (136), I was going for the opposite of the first koi (which if there is any consistency in pattern development probably would have ended up Shiro Muji anyway). I picked this one cause of the body, as much as I could tell at the 1st size. And it has every bit the body I could hope for at this stage. My only caution red flag about the body (and I can easily be way off about this) is that it may be just the slightest bit too "husky" at this age? Just a feeling more than actual observation. The proportions seem very good to me (head size, pec fins, etc etc) I think this may also be related to it's attitude toward eating (see later point) If it keeps up this trend it could have a monster good body at large size, or maybe just have a “beer gut” as it gets to that bigger size. Might have to cut it’s rations (ha). If the pattern were finished (TG it’s not) then it would be killer in a show right now with body and shiro where it is.

    Trends? Well, it went from originally almost no pattern, to almost completely black within a month, back to almost no sumi, and then has slowly zeroed in on what you see now. The pattern feels more stable now, very little change in last 6 months. I will say that other than about a month early last year in the big pond, this koi has always been in the liner quarantine pond of 1200 gallons. I'm watching the pattern stability carefully and this pattern seems to be “hardening up” a little right where it is. Especially now that I moved it back into the big pond again at the final picture time a month ago. Temp 69F there now for the early growing season before our show in August. The white is whiter, and the black a bit darker, still in the same places, just not finished. . I chalk at least some of the early variation up to it’s acclimation to our water. OTOH, I see a lot of changes in other people’s koi too, so maybe that’s what Omosako SU do. But if I look back at the original “pattern”, I can see the hints of what it is now. Hope it keeps that. The skin has always looked good to me on this koi. The 19” Dainichi SU, also in the big pond, while nice, does not have the fukurin or body this one does. Also having them side by side gives a kind of “reference” for the sumi. The sumi on this Omosako has slightly more lacquer feel to it. We often think of the beni and shiro on good kohaku as having that silky look to it, the sumi and shiro on this koi have that, if that’s possible for sumi.

    Concerns? Body and pattern might finish too soon for me (>30”) which would likely send it back to the quarantine pond someday. That and/or turning out to be male. Feeling a bit more like female now than early on, but this year will tell for sure. If it makes it through this year, then I see it truly being more a long journey koi for us. The attitude toward eating was a pleasant surprise, although the one that died was an even more hearty eater. So maybe that is common among Omosako? I believe it often is among Matsunosuke koi, for example, with the Magoi blood. Nothing much more frustrating after clearing all the obvious hurdles than to have a nice koi that just won’t eat much. I’m digging the ‘tude.

    What did I really learn? Buy Nisai or older for longer term “sureness” of what a koi is. But this has been fun and enlightening for sure. Maybe I can drone on a bit

  6. #26
    Daihonmei PapaBear's Avatar
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    Feel free to drone on, wax eloquent, whatever your lovely bride may choose to call it
    Actually your observations are precisely the kind of info I was looking for. It's nice to be able to compare notes with others observations and I can only hope others will do the same as you. Both on the ones that turned out well AND the ones that did not.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Winkler View Post
    Thank you for the kind comment Junichi That means much coming from you, no matter the final result of this friendly competition. And in that vein, I am encouraged for it's future as of now. We just went with a critical eye through our whole collection to cull out several koi to make room for this koi, and two others in the main pond. (Anybody want a 26" chagoi?) I am happy to say that this koi would have made the "cut" any way you slice it It also has the robust attitude I like for future growth, and eats consistently from my hand at 14" amongst the big girls.
    That is a good one indeed and I would like to call the fish as a dream tategoi uturi.
    Bob, I thought you are Showa-man and it proves that you are SU-man too.....
    Omosako-san may regret that the fish shouldn't have released early from their facility.....

  8. #28
    Sansai
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    I agree. Great selection and care. That fish is looking very special.

  9. #29
    Tosai
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    just a test...

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