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Thread: Koi Stocking Density Equation

  1. #11
    Honmei
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    Lam,
    First you have to define "High Stocking densities".
    A pond's success is "relational" in its design. The higher the stocking density, the more filtration, the faster the turn over and the frequent that maintenance needs to be performed based on a given level of food consumption and waste produced for the particular food(s) being consumed. Add to that and additional water changes (hopefully in conjunction with additional filter cleanings.

    When people ask me about designing a pond, my first question is "how many adult Koi (30") do you want to have?" I then take that number and add 50% and design accordingly based on other design criteria and considerations.

    The higher the stocking level (for a given body of water), the less stable that environment will be along with more human intervention that is necessary. So while you can design for extreme stocking densities, I am not in favor of such.

    Also keep in mind, the "expectations" wanted from the pond are also a huge factor. Are the koi going to be shown? Are they to compete at a GC level or simply for the owner's enjoyment?

    For most hobbyists, a 1000 gallon per mature koi is a workable number (no, not high density) that when the "system" is designed properly, can lead to full developement potential for the koi, be easily maintained and provide for a stable environment. Once a stocking density is more than 500 gallons per Koi (for a similar design), then interventions and added equipment become much more intricate.

    Steve
    The views presented are my personal views and not that of any organization that I may belong to unless otherwise specified. [email protected]
    CKHPA

  2. #12
    Daihonmei PapaBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lam Nguyen View Post
    ........do you remember what the title of the stocking thread is on KoiShack? I tried searching but couldn't find it. ...
    I wish I could remember, but my brain cells are nearly as congested as my sinuses these days The thread was one that sprang up out of a series of discussions resulting from the lawsuit in Bakersfield about the porta-potty R&G pond that Frank Morales did a complete replacement build on. (The homeowners had to sue the original contractor and Frank came in and fixed the mess) There was a lot of talk about coming up with a legal definition of a "Koi Pond" vs a "Water Garden" from informed sources rather than leaving it in the incompetent hands of a Judge Needless to say that issue provoked a lot of interesting discussions.

    Quote Originally Posted by schildkoi View Post
    Lam,
    ...
    When people ask me about designing a pond, my first question is "how many adult Koi (30") do you want to have?" I then take that number and add 50% and design accordingly based on other design criteria and considerations.
    ...
    Steve
    To me the bolded portion of Steve's reply is one of the most often overlooked and underappreciated keys to a good design. Buying 50 tosai has no relationship to raising them up to 30" show Koi, unless you design the pond for 50 30" show Koi to begin with.

    Quote Originally Posted by schildkoi View Post
    ...
    The higher the stocking level (for a given body of water), the less stable that environment will be along with more human intervention that is necessary. So while you can design for extreme stocking densities, I am not in favor of such.

    ... Once a stocking density is more than 500 gallons per Koi (for a similar design), then interventions and added equipment become much more intricate.

    Steve
    Quote Originally Posted by Lam Nguyen View Post
    .......David Soon stocked 25 extremely high quality gosanke in his new 40 ton pond 2'9" deep pond. If my calculation is right, this equates to about 420 US gal per koi. His TOR is twice per hour and his filtration is like a nuclear plant!!!!!!
    I think you see the connection between Steve's statement and your observations about David's pond.
    Larry Iles
    Oklahoma

  3. #13
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
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    With some folks on this board talking about re-stockng, and much discussion on other boards about re-homing koi to reduce stocking, I thought it a good time to bump up this thread.

  4. #14
    Oyagoi yerrag's Avatar
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    What does "bump up" mean, Mike?

  5. #15
    Tosai uhmyearightok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yerrag View Post
    What does "bump up" mean, Mike?
    I'm not Mike, but "bump up" means to bring the thread back up the top level/page of the section of the forum it resides in.

    (Old threads get buried deeper and deeper from the first page as new ones are created, but when you post a reply to an old thread that is several pages back it comes back up to the first page. This is called "bumping" the thread up.)

  6. #16
    Oyagoi yerrag's Avatar
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    Thanks! Sometimes stay away too long

  7. #17
    Tategoi semi skilled keeper's Avatar
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    Hi ALL as a new member I had not seen this thread before. Thanks for bumping it ( BRINGING IT BACK )
    2 THINGS NOT MENTIONED
    1 Surface area, The interface of water and air is what aids the pond to breath. This is were toxic gas can leave the water and Oxygen can enter.
    Reducing this will put a strain on the filtration.
    2 depth, The Japanese think ( and have probably )proven that if you want to produce Oyagoi of over a meter , 1 you need go genetics an 2 you need over 3.5 meters deep ponds. I totally understand the concept of fish growing to the size of their environment , which is a bit like stocking densities and how small fish grow better in shallow water.
    The fact that Koi grow deeper bodies in deeper water was only an extrapolation of known facts.
    Question ? How long have the Japanese known this ?Why has it only been mentioned in the last ten years ?

    Brian

  8. #18
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
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    I have a Momotaro Sanke I believe to be one meter in length (I have not measured her, but she is noticeably longer than a McCann Sanke measured at 97cm last March). I acquired her as a 50cm nisai in 2007 (hatched in 2006), raising her in my pond, which is 6-feet deep (less than 2 meters). Reaching a meter by the eighth year is about what Momotaro accomplishes. So, I do not believe 3 meters or deeper is necessary to get the genetic potential to show itself. I do believe water volume is important to allow proper swimming movement. Depth can help get volume.

  9. #19
    Tategoi semi skilled keeper's Avatar
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    Hi MikeM, WHATEVER you are doing, DO NOT CHANGE IT ! the Koi are thriving and as you put it, you ARE getting the genetic potential out of the fish.
    Do you think depth would give your Koi more depth to their body shape ? Or are they already nice well rounded fish.

    What are your thoughts on surface area ?

    Thanks for your input
    Brian

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