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Thread: My Doitsu "red and white and black" koi was harvested

  1. #1
    Oyagoi Ethan25's Avatar
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    My Doitsu "red and white and black" koi was harvested

    went in at 15", came out at a solid 20"....

    low resolution pics taken with my iphone...better ones later...

    I am pleased.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails My Doitsu "red and white and black" koi was harvested-1.jpg   My Doitsu "red and white and black" koi was harvested-2.jpg   My Doitsu "red and white and black" koi was harvested-3.jpg   My Doitsu "red and white and black" koi was harvested-4.jpg  

  2. #2
    Guest Nancy M.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethan25 View Post
    went in at 15", came out at a solid 20"....

    low resolution pics taken with my iphone...better ones later...

    I am pleased.
    Yep it is a Beni Kumunru, no sign at all of a D-showa

  3. #3
    Oyagoi Ethan25's Avatar
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    O so glad you were the first and brave enough to post about her Nancy! Hope you are feeling better! Question: ever seen a bekko that is projected to become a shiro? Or, that goshiki I have that you first thought was a kohaku? As tosai and nisai grow, they sometimes move to different classifications, Nancy, and you should know that! I don't know....maybe you just buy all your koi as the finished product??

    I am not being
    combative.

    I am pointing out what I consider to be a significant oversight on your part.

    Regards,

    Ethan

  4. #4
    Jumbo
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    It was good to see you and your lovely wife at the mud pond pull Ethan. I hope you had a good time...I had a blast. It was good to see your fish come out of the mud. Good growth lengthwise on your yonsai. What are your plans for this fish? I had a concern and thought I noticed an indentation at the front of the ridge-line of the backbone of this fish. Funny how somethings will pop out at you sometimes. On a Doitsu, I guess things are more noticeable. Did you take your fish home? Missed you at Troy's after all the fish were pulled and the hunt for the missing was concluded.

  5. #5
    Guest Nancy M.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethan25 View Post
    O so glad you were the first and brave enough to post about her Nancy! Hope you are feeling better! Question: ever seen a bekko that is projected to become a shiro? Or, that goshiki I have that you first thought was a kohaku? As tosai and nisai grow, they sometimes move to different classifications, Nancy, and you should know that! I don't know....maybe you just buy all your koi as the finished product??

    I am not being
    combative.

    I am pointing out what I consider to be a significant oversight on your part.

    Regards,

    Ethan
    Ethan

    Are you really that thick headed, or just plain friggin deaf.......
    NO FISH CAN CHANGE ITS GENETICS..............

    Regarding your goshiki, regardless of what it looks like today, if it is a goshiki at always was and always will be a goshiki...

    A bekko projected to be a shiro, get real please...

    Ethan you keep trying to walk the walk, but you still don't get it..........

    Did you at least learn why one can not judge thick beni from a picture over the weekend?

    Ethan, honestly I am sick of your wanna be, know it all crap.

    Grow up, and start opening your ears and listening to people that have knowledge......

    Why don't you get a mentor, with lots of patience and knowledge, because frankly I don't have the patience for you.

    PS I am feeling much better thanks for asking.

  6. #6
    Guest Nancy M.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethan25 View Post
    O As tosai and nisai grow, they sometimes move to different classifications, Nancy, and you should know that! I don't know....maybe you just buy all your koi as the finished product??

    Regards,

    Ethan
    Ethan, sorry know I don't only purchase finished fish as that would be a waste of money, who in there right mind would by the flower already cut and wilting??? I do buy fish that i know the exact and correct variety at time of purchase.............

  7. #7
    Oyagoi Ethan25's Avatar
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    Nancy, Nancy, Nancy....

    I am not talking about a fish changing it's genetics...I am talking about it portraying itself as something else becAuse it hasn't made it yet to the finished product. This fish has the genetics of both doitsu showa and benikumonryu. Glad you have made up your mind as to what it will be at maturity.

    I think that listening to a breeder is worthwhile inthis situation, Nancy. Yes, mentors are good. Mine have been very helpful, and encourage me not to back down from those who are unteachable.

    Regards, Ethan

  8. #8
    Oyagoi
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    Ethan
    now actually being at something live.what is your thoughts?
    how about the rest of the koi that came out of the mud?
    how about changes that pictures showed at beginning of year and then seeing the live koi after the pond pull.could you see the changes and guessed what was going to happen from photos?
    how about changes in koi from measure tub to little later in day after being in clean water?

    just looking for personal thoughts of what happened that day?

  9. #9
    Oyagoi CarolinaGirl's Avatar
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    Ethan, let this go. Do you REALLY think for one second that Nancy is unteachable? I think she has the GCs in her pond to prove she has learned a little bit more about this hobby than you have. Not backing down when you think you are right fine, but standing your ground can be done with humility and grace. Not something you are exhibiting right now.

  10. #10
    Oyagoi Ethan25's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nancy M. View Post
    Ethan

    Are you really that thick headed, or just plain friggin deaf.......
    NO FISH CAN CHANGE ITS GENETICS..............

    Regarding your goshiki, regardless of what it looks like today, if it is a goshiki at always was and always will be a goshiki...

    A bekko projected to be a shiro, get real please...

    Ethan you keep trying to walk the walk, but you still don't get it..........

    Did you at least learn why one can not judge thick beni from a picture over the weekend?

    Ethan, honestly I am sick of your wanna be, know it all crap.

    Grow up, and start opening your ears and listening to people that have knowledge......

    Why don't you get a mentor, with lots of patience and knowledge, because frankly I don't have the patience for you.

    PS I am feeling much better thanks for asking.
    Quote Originally Posted by CarolinaGirl View Post
    Ethan, let this go. Do you REALLY think for one second that Nancy is unteachable? I think she has the GCs in her pond to prove she has learned a little bit more about this hobby than you have. Not backing down when you think you are right fine, but standing your ground can be done with humility and grace. Not something you are exhibiting right now.

    So, now it is not proper for me to defend what I see to be true, becuase I am the one not doing it with humility and grace? Come on, Carolina GIrl! Look at what is happening here! Just becuase I am defending what I think to be accurate, I am getting shot down left and right with criticism of myself, not even what I am saying.

    Not one person has proven what I think it true to be false, that being that this fish exhibits some traits, and more importantly, the heritage of showa and beni kumonryu.

    For me to enter this fish into the showa class would be pointless now. It'd do poorly, becuase it appears currently as beni kumonryu. Will it eventually look like a showa? I hope so, but currently, it doesn't, as the sumi is way down due to the mud pond. Does it necessarily have to look like a showa? no. THe genetics are there for it to go that way, but many of us have a failed fish or two that never made it.

    It is just like my "goshiki". It looks like a kohaku right now. Itd be pointless showing it (in my opinion), as it shows some goshiki traits that would make it worthless showing as a kohaku....so, the waiting game ensues. Patience is necessary....just as it is with shiros....shiros can only show a tad bit of sumi at the beginning, yet blossom into a brilliant shiro years down the road.

    NO ONE has addressed the genetic background of this fish since I have posted that information. WHy? I have no idea.

    At one point, yes, I believe Nancy was teachable as she obviously knows her way around the hobby. However, all she has proven to me is that she wishes to criticise what I have been taught regarding this fish.

    Nancy, I have plenty of mentors who have helped me and who consider this fish to potentially be a doitsu showa in the works. I don;t see why you are not okay with that possibility.
    The views I have are completely representative of who I am, and may/may not be representative of clubs I may or may not be a part of.

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