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Thread: Shrio Utsuri autopsy

  1. #1
    Sansai WayneB's Avatar
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    Shrio Utsuri autopsy

    Hi All

    One of my kois started to look very swollen a month ago. The local breeders in my country advised me to spawn her immidiatly before as it looked as if she might develop septicemia. I tried to spawn her without any success. The last few days i noticed that she was swimming on her own alot either floating close to the surface or laying at the bottom. Today i netted her and noticed that she looked very bad, she developed yellowy coloured patches and that she had pop-eye. She also had a few rows with razed scales and he anus looked purpel and swollen. So now i knew that something was wrong internally because she was getting dropsy.

    You can see the whole history on my local forum - Knysna koi farm Shiru Utsuri

    After speaking to a few friends i decided to rather put her down and do an autopsy. Can some of you here please help me identify what could possible have been wrong?

    Here are some pictures. I have never done an autopsy before...Notice where the eggs are - im not sure if that is where it should be but it seems to be right between the swimbladder and the liver? What is the heavy red jelly looking blood inside her body cafity?






  2. #2
    Daihonmei PapaBear's Avatar
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    My autopsy experience is limited to say the least (I like it that way), so I can't offer much beyond the clotted blood making a slow bleed quite likely prior to you putting here down. Tracking down the source is the hard part as there are plenty of possibilities. The only one I've had to deal with had an apparent heart defect and she went from healthy to dead from a ruptured heart in a matter of minutes. The fact that she was developing dropsy could easily have been from the excess pressure the accumulation of blood in the body cavity was creating, but that is pure speculation on my part. I always look forward to what our experienced KHA's have to say on these threads and I hope one of them chimes in here.
    Larry Iles
    Oklahoma

  3. #3
    Tategoi
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    Again I'm no expert but that fish has serious liver problems from what I can see...in fact I don't see a liver at all but a mass of blood clots and dead blood.

    The liver should be a beige, reddish well defined organ in and around the gut and that egg mass. All I see is that clot that you pulled out laying on the table and what's left of it with in the cavity...I'd say liver failure

  4. #4
    Oyagoi kntry's Avatar
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    No expert here either but that mass of blood could be the deteriorating liver. I don't see one in the cavity either. It also looks like a spot on the swim bladder.

  5. #5
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    Sandy if you're referring to that liver coloured saddle on the swimbladder that is a kidney.

    That b;ladder overall doesn't look great but then again the fish is dead

  6. #6
    Daihonmei PapaBear's Avatar
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    So are you guys leaning toward the liver slowly disintegrating into necrotic tissue and bleeding out?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaBear View Post
    So are you guys leaning toward the liver slowly disintegrating into necrotic tissue and bleeding out?

    Larry I don't see anything there that looks like a liver of any kind....I dug into the books and I can't find anything that looks like the bloody mess.....

    As to why the liver shut down and died??? I have no idea

  8. #8
    Sansai WayneB's Avatar
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    Thank you guys. Something i forgot to mention. In the last two weeks one could see a redish, yellowy liqued come out of her vent as she swam.

    The elongated blood clot on the table actually fell out of her as i made the first incitions. I did not remove or move anything. I just opened her side and lifted the "flap" backwards.

    So far i have had 3 explainations.

    1. The red gung inside is due to the kidneys stopping to work and being unable to excrete it.
    2. Ovary tumor.
    3. Liver bleeding out.

    Here is a picture of what she looked like in the beginning and then one from 3 weeks ago.


  9. #9
    Oyagoi kntry's Avatar
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    I don't think the first 2 apply.

    If the kidneys stopped working, she would pinecone but it wouldn't/shouldn't cause the clotted blood or whatever that mass is.

    An ovarian tumor wouldn't develop that fast and it is a huge whitish, solid mass that "explodes" out when you make the incision like you said the bloody mass did.

  10. #10
    Sansai WayneB's Avatar
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    Thank you to everyone that commented. I was really in two minds when i anythetized her. I was concerned that i was not doing the right thing...but after actually doing the autopsy and getting comments regarding the pictures i feel so much better. It was difficult for me to put her down and its not somethng i would like to do again. The two pictures above are takin roughly a year apart.

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