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Thread: Quick Question- What triggers a female to become egg bound?

  1. #1
    Nisai
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    Quick Question- What triggers a female to become egg bound?

    Quick Question- What triggers a female to become egg bound?

    Is there a trigger such as introducing a male to the female?

    Or does it start producing eggs automatically as temperatures go up?

  2. #2
    Daihonmei dick benbow's Avatar
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    wish there was a "quick" answer

    Females generally mature sexually at the age of three and begin egg production. Normally in nature, she would lay the eggs and then spend the next year rebuilding them. When we keep females for show and exclude the males this creates an opportunity for the ritual to be usurped. If we keep them in a warm environment and feed in the winter, the protein goes into egg production and not growth. A coupla seasons of this and the possibility increases for the opportunity to get egg bound.

  3. #3
    Daihonmei
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    there isn't a "trigger"
    the only possible "trigger" could be to have a female start spwaning and then pull the males off of her...that is not proven to cause "egg-bondness" But it is the likely only "trigger"...females become egg-bound du to a chronic not an acute condition

  4. #4
    Nisai ZUROBI3's Avatar
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    For what I'm understand is that they're ready to have eggs every year in the season or not, I'm new and I want to learn too, just got a female tango kohaku that have tons of eggs and already got the fry

  5. #5
    Daihonmei
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    yes, there is a trigger of sorts.

    A koi and many fish ( and birds for that matter) are seasonal breeders. The thing that makes them seasonal breeders is a series of conditions that slowly bring their bodies into breeding condition. So actually breeding conditioning begins the autumn before the up and coming spring time ( when conditions are right and 'tell' the fish it is time to breed and the best time for the spawn to survive). This domino begins in autumn when the reproductive organs begin to change in response to changes in diet, temperatures and lighting.
    The next trigger is the courtship trigger. Assuming the koi has been conditioned by seasons and now emerges from winter into warmer water and much brighter light ( and an increase in calories and proteins in it's diet) the fish is now susceptable to external hormones and internal hormones. The presents and rising levels of hormones and the length of days and other cycle ( moon) will bring the males and females into a strong sex drive.
    It is during this time that 90% of koi will be stimulated finally by behavior. In birds this is a complicated ritual of dance display, nest building etc. In fish like koi, it is the presence and schooling/herding behavior that triggers the final release of eggs and sperm.

    Hope this helps fill in the big picture of triggers in carp breeding. JR

  6. #6
    Tategoi Louie's Avatar
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    Hi Jr,
    Remember the lone Kohaku female that laid her eggs at the show in Gardena last month ? We had a warm weekend and a number of tanks had spawns. First time I have seen it happen with a lone female. I think she was a 3yr old. Perhaps being egg bound is just a bio problem that can happen with any life form.
    Louie

  7. #7
    Daihonmei PapaBear's Avatar
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    Personally, I think an "egg bound" condition is generally the product of human intervention. If we do things to interrupt the natural spawning cycle they can become egg bound, but females spawning at shows is a fairly common occurence, even without a male present. JR mentioned changes in conditions like water temperatures, sunlight, etc... as triggers for a spontaneous spawn. Moving a gravid female from one water chemistry and temperature (home) to another (the show) is a natural trigger element.

  8. #8
    Daihonmei
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    Quote Originally Posted by Louie View Post
    Hi Jr,
    Remember the lone Kohaku female that laid her eggs at the show in Gardena last month ? We had a warm weekend and a number of tanks had spawns. First time I have seen it happen with a lone female. I think she was a 3yr old. Perhaps being egg bound is just a bio problem that can happen with any life form.
    Louie

    Hi Louie, great to see all my West coast friends out in LA and great to get to some early spring weather ( long before it starts out here!).

    'Egg bound' is one of those hobby words like
    Dropsy' that suggests a symptom is actually a disease. And although there is a disease that can be called dropsy, all swelling in the body and gathering of fluids in the dermis/epidermis are also called dropsy.
    Egg bound as a disease means that the eggs are unable to be pasted and often the egg mass is dead, solid or putrified. This is typically a death sentence.
    The retention of eggs either to an excess mass of living eggs or simply an omni-present egg mass in a female is more a case metabolic disorder.
    Most hobbyists do not take the intimate link between environmental conditions and the hormonal system serious. Yet the evidence of koi's natural rhythm with temperature, light and diet are all around us. And if you trigger part of the natural cadance of egg production but block other signals you naturally get a 'confused' physiological response. Restoring the natural cycle usually puts the fish right back on track.

    Louie I do remember the incident of the spawn ( a la naturale) . It was indeed the warming of the sun and water change that trigger the reaction. And in the othe rtank where spawning too place even females were schooling and triggering other females to drop their eggs. ( although there were males present in that one). The final key/trigger is the dropping of the 'plug' mucous plug in the female. And then the rubbing on a stationary object for depositing the now loose eggs. In that case the female was using the blue show tank bulhead drain to rub against and deposit here egg mass. In the process she was causing minor damage to herself. But rubbing is part of the triggering series and can't be helped.
    But none of these fish were egg bound-- just filled with eggs to the point of ripeness.
    So try and differenciate between a fish that is egg bound and demonstrating a diseased function and a fish that is simpy ripe/gravid and off her natural physiological/metabolic cycle. JR

  9. #9
    Oyagoi Flounder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasPR View Post
    But none of these fish were egg bound-- just filled with eggs to the point of ripeness.
    Jr, what is one to do if the females are ripe with eggs this time of year other than spawn them?

  10. #10
    Daihonmei
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    If your koi is healthy then ' seasonal' egg mass is a fact of life. What you want is for the female koi figure to remain but be excessive. usually by autumn this gravid look resolves itself. Much of that regulation is down to diet and feeding technique
    I have all female koi ( one old male) and they have never spawned in 15 plus years except for one planned breeding three years ago. But none are weighed down by excessive egg presence. The reason is, I feed and maintain my koi as four season fish. That means regulation of food volume and mix. And fasting in winter. It's not MY system of management, it is simply recognizing and respecting the hormonal cycle of a temperate water seasonal species. JR

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