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Thread: Mythbusted - no full moon required

  1. #1
    Oyagoi mrbradleybradley's Avatar
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    Mythbusted - no full moon required

    I was reading one of those koi related websites you find via google and like too many, there was an abundance of misleading information relating to the relationship between the moon cycle and times of spawning.

    Down my way I asked a bunch of people in my area to tell me the dates their koi spawned this year. The results come from 24 different spawnings, some occuring on the same date.

    There are several factors involved in triggering a koi spawn, but the moon cycle is not one of them. There is absolutely NO correlation between a FULL MOON and spawning. If there was you would a have expected the dates to occur around the same time (before of after) as the dates for the full moon.

    For a quick visual, take a look at the simple table from the collected data & posted below.

  2. #2
    Oyagoi kingkong's Avatar
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    I would say lunar yes in marine water due to tides but fresh water would be more a temperature thing.

  3. #3
    Honmei
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrbradleybradley View Post
    I was reading one of those koi related websites you find via google and like too many, there was an abundance of misleading information relating to the relationship between the moon cycle and times of spawning.

    Down my way I asked a bunch of people in my area to tell me the dates their koi spawned this year. The results come from 24 different spawnings, some occuring on the same date.

    There are several factors involved in triggering a koi spawn, but the moon cycle is not one of them. There is absolutely NO correlation between a FULL MOON and spawning. If there was you would a have expected the dates to occur around the same time (before of after) as the dates for the full moon.

    For a quick visual, take a look at the simple table from the collected data & posted below.
    Very interesting Bradley, but as you pointed out, there are many other factors that can come into play. BUT, if we take your data on face value alone, we find that there is a equal distribution in the numbers of days +/- from spawning to full moon. This alone would seem to bust the myth.

    Unfortunately there are still those other factors and how they may have or may not have affected the results. We know that water temperatures and changes in such have a direct affect. These two factors alone can throw the results off, or substantiate such. Were water temps constant? Were there no changes in such? If not and so (respectively) how does this change the results. Any barometric weather changes (low pressure storms)?

    All too often we think that there is a 1 to one relationship, only looking at two factors without regard to other factors and then draw conclusions based upon such, conclusions that may very well be incorrect.

    Here's some additional questions for those spawns:

    Were the koi moved to spawn?
    If so, how long after moving such were they spawned?
    Were all spawns natural?
    Were there any storm systems and if so, how many days plus or minus for each spawning?
    What were the water temps at the time of spawning? If moved to spawn, what and how much water temp swing was there. If not moved, was there any water temps swings?

    Now, with each answered question, each spawning would then be reclassified into different groups with common denominators. The problem then comes that within each group, I would bet that there would be very small numbers and as such the actual results would then become statistically insignificant to draw further conclusions on..perhaps not.

    Perhaps a better question would be of breeders and what conditions do they find the best spawning results under?
    The views presented are my personal views and not that of any organization that I may belong to unless otherwise specified. [email protected]
    CKHPA

  4. #4
    Oyagoi
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    "Perhaps a better question would be of breeders and what conditions do they find the best spawning results under?" quoted from Steve

    No doubt I've found a strong correlation between moon phases and spawnings. However, nothing will trigger a koi to spawn if it is not in spawning condition (gravid).

    Full moon and cold weather-no spawn
    Full moon and very hot-no spawn
    Full moon in proper temperature range with gravid fish-spawn.

    Late spring/early summer cool fronts and/or low pressure systems accompanied with rainfall tend to trigger spawning, even among fish that have already spawned once. Warm (not hot) weather and thunderstorms, a good bet. Early summer tropical system in June, good chance of a spawn.

    Early spring warm spells can do it too. If warm for two or three weeks in February, good chance of a spawn, especially if warm at the time of the full moon.

    Now, taken into the context of fish farming.....we are not dependent upon the moon or weather for a spawn. We do need gravid fish in good shape. If the fish is close to ready, hormone injections can trigger a spawn, and that is how I time the spawn to my convenience (within the context of the fish being ready). As a general rule, fish farmers will try and coincide spawning in the hatchery with the weather and moon phases to the extent practical. This generally gives a more favorable result, even if using hormones.

    But no, you do not need any of these to trigger spawning if the fish is in condition to do so.
    Brett

  5. #5
    Honmei
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fishbreeder View Post
    "Perhaps a better question would be of breeders and what conditions do they find the best spawning results under?" quoted from Steve

    No doubt I've found a strong correlation between moon phases and spawnings. However, nothing will trigger a koi to spawn if it is not in spawning condition (gravid).

    Full moon and cold weather-no spawn
    Full moon and very hot-no spawn
    Full moon in proper temperature range with gravid fish-spawn.

    Late spring/early summer cool fronts and/or low pressure systems accompanied with rainfall tend to trigger spawning, even among fish that have already spawned once. Warm (not hot) weather and thunderstorms, a good bet. Early summer tropical system in June, good chance of a spawn.

    Early spring warm spells can do it too. If warm for two or three weeks in February, good chance of a spawn, especially if warm at the time of the full moon.

    Now, taken into the context of fish farming.....we are not dependent upon the moon or weather for a spawn. We do need gravid fish in good shape. If the fish is close to ready, hormone injections can trigger a spawn, and that is how I time the spawn to my convenience (within the context of the fish being ready). As a general rule, fish farmers will try and coincide spawning in the hatchery with the weather and moon phases to the extent practical. This generally gives a more favorable result, even if using hormones.

    But no, you do not need any of these to trigger spawning if the fish is in condition to do so.
    Thank you Brett. I seem to recall us talking about this many years ago. Seems my memory isn't as bad as I thought.
    The views presented are my personal views and not that of any organization that I may belong to unless otherwise specified. [email protected]
    CKHPA

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