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Thread: Can we compare filtration systems?

  1. #11
    Oyagoi HEADACHE6's Avatar
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    Sandy, Something that Ray touched on when he posted (Slope of bottom of pond).

    You can have the greatest filtering system on earth, but if you can't get the water & debris to it it's worthless .

  2. #12
    Honmei
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    Quote Originally Posted by HEADACHE6 View Post
    I would never suggest we allow Debris to go to our Bio. Depending on one's "system" , if adding a skimmer to a SC is going to increase the water flow within the SC because of an added pump then I'm going with plan "B". I'd rather the SC have a perfect flow rate from my BD's then a over flow rate because we added another pump from the skimmer unit causing the SC not to work it's best. If we have the skimmer and BD's on the same pump (I don't) well I'll listen to the idea.

    I'm lucky as I work from my Home. My skimmer has a net to catch leaves, etc. , then behind that a layer of J-Mat to catch anything that is fine. This is cleaned every morning while the coffee brews.
    Troy,
    As you know I am lazy....errrrrr change that to "efficient." I haven't had to clean a messy skimmer basket in ages. BTW, the gravity fed skimmer has its own SC. I never combine skimmer and drain circuits for a wide variety of reasons.
    The views presented are my personal views and not that of any organization that I may belong to unless otherwise specified. [email protected]
    CKHPA

  3. #13
    Daihonmei
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    One thing is an indisputable fact: if a system is difficult to maintain and clean, it will sooner or later, NOT be attended to the way it needs to be.
    That sets up a declining situation over time as it is very hard to get up every day and do dirty and clumbsy filter maintenace.
    That is one of the reasons I have talked about LONG term systems very SHORT term systems so often.
    In a variation of " if you build it they will come " ( forgot that one Cheryl!) --- " if you build it, you must also maintain it!" LOLs

    And as Steve just suggested, biochambers are very dependent on levels of effiency so as the biofouling occurs, the micro environment begins to shift. And the efficiency is lost. The ultimate example of this is the BB, who's efficiency can decline in a matter of hours. On the opposite end is the The TT which is virtually 'immortal' in efficiency. JR

  4. #14
    Oyagoi HEADACHE6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by schildkoi View Post
    Troy,
    As you know I am lazy....errrrrr change that to "efficient." I haven't had to clean a messy skimmer basket in ages. BTW, the gravity fed skimmer has its own SC. I never combine skimmer and drain circuits for a wide variety of reasons.

    Lazy ? I've seen you mostly from a Friday to Sunday and I don't remember Lazy ! I'll ask Cheryl in May what happens at home .


    The reason I brought up space limitations in my first post is so many hobbyist won't/don't have the room for multiple SC's , some have room for none.

  5. #15
    Honmei
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    Quote Originally Posted by HEADACHE6 View Post
    Lazy ? I've seen you mostly from a Friday to Sunday and I don't remember Lazy ! I'll ask Cheryl in May what happens at home .


    The reason I brought up space limitations in my first post is so many hobbyist won't/don't have the room for multiple SC's , some have room for none.
    Space limitations is typically a "cop out". You'd be surprised how some great ponds, with great filtration systems fit into very limited spaces. it more frequently boils down to rationalizing not doing something using "space" instead of the more factual based reason of not willing to part with additional dollars.
    The views presented are my personal views and not that of any organization that I may belong to unless otherwise specified. [email protected]
    CKHPA

  6. #16
    Daihonmei
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    I agree. I think that marketing has seen a need and taken full advantage of that need- to introduce something based on looks and presentation while compromising performance. I look at many of these systems as an audiophile might look at transistor radios!
    Remote locations. Going 'up' instead of sideways. hidding the filter below the decks- many ways to go... JR

  7. #17
    Tategoi Erns's Avatar
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    Because of the rising cost of electricity I recently changed my system.
    First photo is of what I use to have. Big pump fed system from a 2000l settlement vortex.

    New System. Two bottom drains - two filter lines. Gravity Fed. First vortex is for settlement. Second vortex is static K1 media, 3rd Vortex is fluidised K1 media then to a pump chamber there I have some oyster shells in bags and a submercible pump using 90watts and delivering 18 000l/h. I had to throttle the pump back a bit as I was not getting any settlement in the first chamber. This system is identical for each bottom drain

    Second independant system. Feeding from my skimmer and two mid water pickups to an adjustble high pressure pump. Then to a multi cyclone where it T's to two bead filters. From the one bead filter I have a bakki shower with 200l of Ogata crystal media and gravity back to pond. From the other bead filter the water is split into two line - one line feeds 4 jets in the pond and the other feeds a protien skimmer to be upgraded to a Clarity unit soon.

    On slow go I'm pumping 48 000l per hour with the option of ramping things up to 66 000l/h as an option.

    After 2 months my water has never been this clear. The last pic is my bottom drain 2.3m deep. We are at the peak of summer with my pond temp at 28 degrees C.

    Would like to hear what you think!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Can we compare filtration systems?-filtration.jpg   Can we compare filtration systems?-filter-line.jpg   Can we compare filtration systems?-settlement.jpg   Can we compare filtration systems?-solids-filter.jpg   Can we compare filtration systems?-biological.jpg  

    Can we compare filtration systems?-pump-chamber.jpg   Can we compare filtration systems?-good-flow-.jpg   Can we compare filtration systems?-pressure-system-1.jpg   Can we compare filtration systems?-20101230_007_798x600.jpg   Can we compare filtration systems?-20101230_005_798x600.jpg  


  8. #18
    Oyagoi HEADACHE6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by schildkoi View Post
    Space limitations is typically a "cop out". You'd be surprised how some great ponds, with great filtration systems fit into very limited spaces. it more frequently boils down to rationalizing not doing something using "space" instead of the more factual based reason of not willing to part with additional dollars.

    I was speaking of multiple SC's because of space, not the reason for a lack of proper filtering of another kind.

    My SC is 250 gals., 5ft across. Having multiple of them for me is not a problem, some it would be.

  9. #19
    Daihonmei dick benbow's Avatar
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    I'm in favor of the river system if I ever get a chance to build my ultimate
    pond. I can't argue with a system that immediately removes waste from the water column (sieve) and love japanese mat in addition with a bakki shower arraingement. Ray's ideas and mine have a lot in common. Pond Length and depth has it's purpose in growing strong bodies, but then seines and long handled nets can make collecting individuals a bit of a planned chore. With NW weather, I'd sure like my pond incorporated within a greenhouse. Most of my ideas were helped formulated by back issues of KB, visits to Japan, and seeing what "the river" has done for Purdin Koi!

    To help Sandy, you almost have to have some background knowledge on her. She doesn't do anything "half-way". She even built her own mudpond recently. She is a very serious koi Kichii. I can't imagine her going for any kind of "turn key " filtration system.
    Dick Benbow

  10. #20
    Fry
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    ideal koi pond filtration

    My "ideal" mechanical filter system would not only seperate but remove solids from the water column proper asap. Lets say down to 40 micron. This would be acccomplished by a rdf.
    Since most of the solids have been removed, this significantly lightens up the load on the biostage of filtration, allowing for a smaller footprint of submerged moving media.This can be followed by static media for fines...and if one should desire energy effiecency this can all be accomplished with gravity flow and air lifts or axial flow pump technology.

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