Home | About Us | Contact Us


Koi Forum - Koi-Bito Magazine straight from Japan
Page 12 of 24 FirstFirst ... 2101112131422 ... LastLast
Results 111 to 120 of 235
Like Tree12Likes

Thread: Water Changes

  1. #111
    Tategoi semi skilled keeper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Nottingham , England.
    Posts
    424
    Hi ALL, if you have mains water , water changes are no big deal if you design your pond correctly to start with.
    A SIMPLE purge and refill set up takes one press of a button, pump to waste from bottom drain. 5 % twice a day, morning and evening
    Chlorine gas is mainly used in U.K. If you have chloramines I would use some form or chemical to remove.

    Or if you you simply have a timed water input , waste will go down the overflow.
    YOU MUST HAVE A TIMER THAT SWITCHES OFF, TOO MUCH FRESH WATER ( WITH CHLORINES ) WILL KILL YOUR kOI.

    Brian

  2. #112
    MCA
    MCA is offline
    Honmei MCA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Atlanta
    Posts
    2,574
    TOO MUCH FRESH WATER ( WITH CHLORINES ) WILL KILL YOUR kOI.
    Why?

    Because chlorine is a very potent oxidizer of organic material, any organic material it touches. The same goes for ozone (O3) and PP. Adding one of the oxidizers in one area of the pond can create a hot spot. If a fish swims into the hot spot, the oxidizer may burn gill lamella. That would be like breathing caustic fumes into our lungs. Bad karma.

    So if you are going to put chlorinated water directly into the pond wihout a dechlor like ST consider:
    • mixing it thoroughly into the pond water to prevent a hot spot that can burn some fish gills
    • do not have the water input near the intake to a filter so as to prevent chlorine from burning filter bacteria
    • never add enough chlorinated water to raise the pond ORP to over 400mV (or you may start to fry fish and filters)


    We all know the stories of folks who left the hose running and ended up with a pond of floating shiro muni. It is much safer to use a few ST crystals (or running the water through a carbon block filter) and a timer on the end of the hose. If you have a nice filter house, use a builtin timer (with failsafe) to let in X gallons/liters of fresh water each day.
    Koi keeping is not a belief system; it is applied science with a touch of artistry.

  3. #113
    Tategoi semi skilled keeper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Nottingham , England.
    Posts
    424
    Yes well said. if you have the space , have a storage tank, into which you put the exchange water, aerate it or dechlorinate with chemicals prior to putting into pond.
    Or mix it with the out flow from your filters.

    Brian

  4. #114
    Oyagoi yerrag's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Manila, Philippines
    Posts
    1,792
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeM View Post
    When I started this thread I focused on weekly percentages of changed out water. That is how most of us think of water changes. However, it is not the best way to approach the question. It is just an easy way to think about things. A person with 50 60cm koi in 4500 U.S. gallons is going to need to do much more than a person with 5 60cm koi in the same pond set-up.

    I have commented before that I use nitrate as a 'marker' for the level of total contaminants in a pond. I do so because it is easier to determine with a test kit. My goal is to have nitrate not in excess of 5ppm. If I was fixated on this, I would vary the size and frequency of water changes to keep nitrate at 5ppm or lower. [I picked 5ppm as being very low and within my capabilities to achieve. Someone else might pick 10ppm or some other level.]

    However, I am fixated on keeping nitrate below 5ppm, and I do not accomplish my goal year round. Most of the time I do, but there are times when nitrate levels rise due to pollen, leaves and such entering the pond. I will increase the weekly water change somewhat, but I do not want to go so far that pH and other parameters are significantly impacted. Since my schedule only permits me to do water changes once per week, maintaining stability becomes the limiting factor.

    I also do not test the water obsessively. Over the years I have gained a sense of the water without testing every week or month the way I did when the pond was first built, but I still test occasionally to simply check on things, and when the water does not 'look right'. And, I'll test frequently if I am trying to determine the impact of a new food, etc. Whenever I test, if nitrate is above 5ppm, I will move toward larger water changes. If nitrate is below 5ppm, the water change will be somewhat smaller.

    A continual in-flow trickle would be the best way to go, but it is not practical with my set-up. I usually change about 5% during the course of the week through dumping a settlement chamber daily, and then change between 25% and 35% once per week. So, the total per week is 30-40%. That's a lot of water, but with mainly very large koi consuming a lot of food daily, it is what is needed to keep the water close to the goal on a fairly consistent basis... and I know I can do this much without causing pH shifts.

    The key thing to remember is that water changes are about maintaining stable conditions in a pond where conditions are perpetually deteriorating.
    Thanks Mike. Your testing for nitrates would give you a practical way to get a good indication of how much regular water changes are needed. That you dump the settlement chamber daily also gives you a greater confidence level, in that you don't have to be "paranoid" about doing so many different tests of water quality.

    As for "water not looking right," I find it to be a very useful check. Even when all the water quality tests I have on hand passes (TDS, kH, gH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate) and the bubbles off my Matala diffuser seem clumped up and drift around the pond, and the film seem thick, I sense there is something else those tests don't tell me. It most likely points to a high level of solid waste accumulation (sump, mechanical filter chamber or bottom drain, or even the biofilter). When the solid wastes are removed, water goes back to looking right.

    What are those things untested for that is causing the water to not look right?

  5. #115
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Orlando, Florida
    Posts
    11,128
    What you describe sounds like a build-up of dissolved organics, or DOC. Water changes are certainly effective in reducing DOC. However, removing solid wastes from the system quickly and frequently helps lower the creation of DOC. That is why it is good to dump settlement chambers daily, if possible. Filter mats, brushes and the like used to entrap debris and waste should likewise be cleaned frequently to get the solid wastes out of the system. Often the elimination of solid wastes from the system is discussed with a focus on health concerns, since pathogens can proliferate with a lot of waste rotting in the system. It also directly affects water quality. Dissolved organics are one product of decomposition.

  6. #116
    Tategoi semi skilled keeper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Nottingham , England.
    Posts
    424
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeM View Post
    What you describe sounds like a build-up of dissolved organics, or DOC. Water changes are certainly effective in reducing DOC. However, removing solid wastes from the system quickly and frequently helps lower the creation of DOC. That is why it is good to dump settlement chambers daily, if possible. Filter mats, brushes and the like used to entrap debris and waste should likewise be cleaned frequently to get the solid wastes out of the system. Often the elimination of solid wastes from the system is discussed with a focus on health concerns, since pathogens can proliferate with a lot of waste rotting in the system. It also directly affects water quality. Dissolved organics are one product of decomposition.
    Hi MikeM , I was once asked to design an ultra fine filter system to give a polished finish to may friends Pond water.
    This surface film was one of the things that occasionally happened which he took exception to.
    He was and still is a keen ( to put it mildly show freek !)
    After getting him to record ALL the food he was feeding, it became obvious that the film appeared 4 hours after feeding fresh foods , such as orange, avocado and the like.
    The film only lasted around 2 hours, so I (we ) decided that the extra cost and space needed was not needed.
    Woven mats made from barley straw do give a superb polish but are hard to find.
    Barley straw is used to stop the growth of many algaes in ponds. in The U.K.

    You have both pointed out the first test for water quality and I think the most important. DOES IT LOOK RIGHT ! IF NOT WHY ?
    The cheapest but most accurate test , known to the Koi keeper.

    Brian

  7. #117
    Nisai Bobby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Cape Town South Africa
    Posts
    121
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeM View Post
    It's time for what has become an annual bump-up. This time for Yerrag's consideration. It seems all concerns relating to pond maintenance eventually return to water changes as the basic and best tool at our disposal.

    BTW, the old Hariwake is now in her 20th year. After a thousand water changes over her lifetime, she knows what is coming when I begin my Saturday morning routine by the pond.
    Fantastic tread, Mike how about a picture of your 20 year old Hariwake, she must be very special to you

  8. #118
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Orlando, Florida
    Posts
    11,128
    Well, are you familiar with the saying 'she has a face only her mother would love'?
    Tora Bora likes this.

  9. #119
    Nisai Bobby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Cape Town South Africa
    Posts
    121
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeM View Post
    Well, are you familiar with the saying 'she has a face only her mother would love'?
    Would love to see her !

  10. #120
    Oyagoi yerrag's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Manila, Philippines
    Posts
    1,792
    Mike:Often the elimination of solid wastes from the system is discussed with a focus on health concerns, since pathogens can proliferate with a lot of waste rotting in the system. It also directly affects water quality. Dissolved organics are one product of decomposition.
    Not that it's a "must," but hope there was a handy API test kit that tests for these DOC's. They have to be a gram-positive or gram-negative kind of test, biological in nature, in contrast to the titration-based chemical tests for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate's that change color at an endpoint.

    Brian:You have both pointed out the first test for water quality and I think the most important. DOES IT LOOK RIGHT ! IF NOT WHY ?
    The cheapest but most accurate test , known to the Koi keeper.
    Yes, after a while you get the hang of it. You think "Hmm...something's not right with these bubbles." Even if you can't figure why, just be trigger happy and open up the faucet and let new water in. A good marker for poor pond upkeep. Unnoticed, uncorrected, it is the highway to the koi medicine cabinet. Fighting small fires at the least, containing a contagion, at worst. Not fun.

Page 12 of 24 FirstFirst ... 2101112131422 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 5
    Last Post: 06-11-, 04:43 PM
  2. add water conditioner when changer water
    By thanhsonnguyen in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: 03-04-2012, 12:21 PM
  3. Replies: 7
    Last Post: 03-25-2010, 10:39 AM
  4. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 07-10-2009, 10:22 AM
  5. Water Test to proove its not pond water
    By gregbickal in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 05-28-2009, 01:12 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Articles - Sitemap - FAQs and Rules

KB Footer Graphic
Straight from Japan... For the serious hobbyist!
All content and images copyright of: Koi-bito.com