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Thread: Which Oyagoi?

  1. #21
    Jumbo Tosai_Sunny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koicjl View Post
    Sunny i am sorry to hear that, but don't give up yet.sometime they don't look like much but after first feeding the eggyoke, you may be surprise, but if you really don't have enough. season is still early so try again.

    This year I have bent so busy and have not start our breeding yet. but
    we can't wait.
    Thanks Chin! I hope that I will be surprised. Unfortunately, I can not see all the frys due to green water which is intended for the daphnia. Feeding them eggyoke is a good idea but it's too messy. I am experimenting with daphnia as their only source for food for the first week for so. After that, I will turn on the UV light to clear up the water to determine the number of frys in this spawn. I will decide then whether to spawn again or not.

    Regards,
    Sunny

  2. #22
    Oyagoi dizzyfish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tosai_Sunny View Post
    I am envious of you, Mitch! I only have about 1,000 gallons to raise my frys. If I ever get serious about spawning, I might rent a mud pond to raise the frys since I can't afford to buy a farm like you did. Best of luck with your endeavor.

    Sanke is one of my favorite varieties. I can't wait to see the progress of your 32" Momo sanke spawn.

    As for my spawn...The eggs have hatched. I see frys swimming around and chasing after daphnia. I was hoping for a few thousands of frys, but I think I only have a few hundreds.

    Regards,
    Sunny
    I began the same way using intex swimmings pools. The babies never would get enough food. I hatched two large jars of brine shrimp everyday, my wife boiled eggs so I could feed the yolk, I bought finely powdered food for baby koi. Changing water without sucking out the fry is difficult. I always managed to raise some, but there were always tobies that outgrow the others and begin eating their siblings. You should separate out any that get much bigger than the others. In some ways having a smaller spawn to work with may be a blessing for you.

    I enjoy having some ponds to work with but it is a lot of hot sweaty work and the joy of seining a mud pond wears off pretty quick, especially when it is very hot and your doing a first culling. It's to hot for chest waders or even hip waders and the mud jerks the shoes off your feet, and it easy to slip and fall. (And I already had ACL surgery) Now if you are buying high quality tosai for growout and doing an October pull.....well that's not so bad......but I like having stuff nobody else has culled.

    Dealing with all the predators is real pain too. Frogs, turtles, snakes, dragon fly larvae are bad enough, but then the herons and kingfishers come. A kingfisher can eat about six 3-4" babies a day. The heron can take their toll on tosai and nisai and sometimes all I find is the swim bladder. Once a heron or a kingfisher find you out, they come back everyday, and sometimes the heron come at night. Then there is all the time and expense of mowing. I mow about 10 acres with a bushhog and a 60" John Deere zero turn, out of 29 acres total. I staked the ponds and ran fishing line to deter the herons, but it get much harder to mow close to the water.....and next small saplings are beginning to grow and need to be pulled out before the roots go to deep.

    Despite the work I like it. My wife raises a big garden. I got a Yamaha Rhino (4-wheeler) and two dogs that love to run. An Australian shepherd and a Border collie both red and white. Both love the water. My problem is that I'm not living on the farm just yet. So in addition to all the mowing at the farm I have a large yard at home too. Anyway I usually go out at least once a day and take my dogs. They both stay wet, and always seem to go in the water about the time I get ready to leave so I have to dry them before they can get into my SUV. And this mild winter has made the ticks really bad. In addition to pulling them off my dogs I've found quite a few on me. That's one reason I try to keep it mowed down, but I've got some woods area that I have to clear of falling limbs and such and cedar trees are full of them. And when you have a farm you learn about chiggers and sweat bees and lots of other stinging, biting, nagging insects.
    So it ain't all fun and games but it can be rewarding.
    Mitch

    PS
    I'm still waiting on Kevin for the male parents to go with the big Sanke. She was kept indoors for several years with all females so this will be the first spawn. I hope she figure it all out. I wish I could get a cup of milt from your big guy. Know anybody that sells milt from good breeder koi? If it works out I'll be in the market for a really good male or two. Good luck and I hope you get a grand champion or two out of your spawn. Renting a pond may be a good way to get your feet wet.

  3. #23
    Jumbo Tosai_Sunny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dizzyfish View Post
    I began the same way using intex swimmings pools. The babies never would get enough food. I hatched two large jars of brine shrimp everyday, my wife boiled eggs so I could feed the yolk, I bought finely powdered food for baby koi. Changing water without sucking out the fry is difficult. I always managed to raise some, but there were always tobies that outgrow the others and begin eating their siblings. You should separate out any that get much bigger than the others. In some ways having a smaller spawn to work with may be a blessing for you.

    I enjoy having some ponds to work with but it is a lot of hot sweaty work and the joy of seining a mud pond wears off pretty quick, especially when it is very hot and your doing a first culling. It's to hot for chest waders or even hip waders and the mud jerks the shoes off your feet, and it easy to slip and fall. (And I already had ACL surgery) Now if you are buying high quality tosai for growout and doing an October pull.....well that's not so bad......but I like having stuff nobody else has culled.

    Dealing with all the predators is real pain too. Frogs, turtles, snakes, dragon fly larvae are bad enough, but then the herons and kingfishers come. A kingfisher can eat about six 3-4" babies a day. The heron can take their toll on tosai and nisai and sometimes all I find is the swim bladder. Once a heron or a kingfisher find you out, they come back everyday, and sometimes the heron come at night. Then there is all the time and expense of mowing. I mow about 10 acres with a bushhog and a 60" John Deere zero turn, out of 29 acres total. I staked the ponds and ran fishing line to deter the herons, but it get much harder to mow close to the water.....and next small saplings are beginning to grow and need to be pulled out before the roots go to deep.

    Despite the work I like it. My wife raises a big garden. I got a Yamaha Rhino (4-wheeler) and two dogs that love to run. An Australian shepherd and a Border collie both red and white. Both love the water. My problem is that I'm not living on the farm just yet. So in addition to all the mowing at the farm I have a large yard at home too. Anyway I usually go out at least once a day and take my dogs. They both stay wet, and always seem to go in the water about the time I get ready to leave so I have to dry them before they can get into my SUV. And this mild winter has made the ticks really bad. In addition to pulling them off my dogs I've found quite a few on me. That's one reason I try to keep it mowed down, but I've got some woods area that I have to clear of falling limbs and such and cedar trees are full of them. And when you have a farm you learn about chiggers and sweat bees and lots of other stinging, biting, nagging insects.
    So it ain't all fun and games but it can be rewarding.
    Mitch

    PS
    I'm still waiting on Kevin for the male parents to go with the big Sanke. She was kept indoors for several years with all females so this will be the first spawn. I hope she figure it all out. I wish I could get a cup of milt from your big guy. Know anybody that sells milt from good breeder koi? If it works out I'll be in the market for a really good male or two. Good luck and I hope you get a grand champion or two out of your spawn. Renting a pond may be a good way to get your feet wet.
    You are right Mitch...smaller spawn would be a blessing for me because of my limitted space. I estimated a couple of thousands of frys would be perfect for my setup. I am planning to cull very aggressively to ensure they will not be overcrowded. I only want about 10 babies to compete against you, Chin, Junichi-san, and whoever else is in on the home-grown competition.

    As for the milk, if you were near by, I would be more than happy lend Sumo to you. I am sure he would thank you and I for the opportunity to meet your Momo girl.


    Regards,
    Sunny

  4. #24
    Jumbo Tosai_Sunny's Avatar
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    Here is the result of the first sembetsu(culling) of my sanke frys. As predicted, this is a very small spawn with only several hundreds of frys that hatched. At about 6 weeks old, they were approx. 1-2 inches in size.




    My "Helpers"(Future Koi Farmers of America)...they wanted to keep all of them. :-)



    A few shinning "stars" of the group :-)


    Cheers,
    Sunny

  5. #25
    Oyagoi Flounder's Avatar
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    Nice job Sunny.

    I think yours are better than mine. This is my first year with the breeding and it's tough, hard work for any backyard hobbyist to get a good koi out of it.

    So much time put into it and very few good koi I see. What I need is a mud pond. I think fom this first attempt I have a few hundreds.

    I'll cull mine soon just don't know what I'll do with the "unwanteds".


  6. #26
    Jumbo Tosai_Sunny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flounder View Post
    Nice job Sunny.

    I think yours are better than mine. This is my first year with the breeding and it's tough, hard work for any backyard hobbyist to get a good koi out of it.

    So much time put into it and very few good koi I see. What I need is a mud pond. I think fom this first attempt I have a few hundreds.

    I'll cull mine soon just don't know what I'll do with the "unwanteds".

    Thanks Ryan! Your first batch is looking pretty good also. Have fun culling them. You are right that it's too much work for just a few "good" koi but it's fun, especially with the little ones involved.

    I think there is no better way to learn about koi than breeding and raising them ourselves. Although, it's unrealistic to think that we can produce grand champions from the backyard, but it would be nice if we could raise a few show worthy fish on our own. Sounds like you may have access to mudponds. If not, I am sure Tom can hook you up. You should go for it next year. The more frys you can raise, the better your chance of getting better fish.

    Regarding your comment in your video about having two defferent size groups in the spawn. I am seeing the same thing. A few of my tobies are humongus comparing to their siblings. When I saw them contantly chasing after the smaller ones in the pond, I decided to evict them. I have read somewhere that besides genetics, food is a major factor. Having abundant of food for them to feed will minimize the disparity in their developement. If you rewatched Bram's sembetsu videos when he was at Dainichi, you will notice their frys were very simuliar in sizes...that's because they were fed well.

    Don't forget to take some photos/videos of your first sembetsu. With proven Dainichi bloodline as oyagoi, I am sure you will have some good ones out of this spawn.

    Cheers,
    Sunny

  7. #27
    Tategoi Yamato's Avatar
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    Waw! Sunny, this is so interesting!

  8. #28
    Jumbo Tosai_Sunny's Avatar
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    What do you think of these muts? :-) I just culled them down to about 2 dozens this passed weekend. They are approximately 3"-5" long. The video below is a sample of them. Any and all comments are welcomed.

    It's been challenging trying to get them to grow due to the extreme Texas heat. Even with shade, my water temperature has been around 85F for over a month now with no relief in site. :-(



    Sunny

  9. #29
    Jumbo Tosai_Sunny's Avatar
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    Here are my top two picks from the spawn at the moment. I am sure that may change as the others are catching up. Both are approximately 5" in size.



    Sunny

  10. #30
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
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    It has been my observation in raising tosai to nisai that when water temperatures exceed 82F (28C) growth slows (but does not stop). It seems to pick up as the temperature declines to 80F and lower.

    The extreme heat around much of the country has had its adverse effects on koi. Still, I think your little ones are growing well, particularly considering that you do not have professional facilities. My thinking is what I have learned raising guppies. Whenever conditions are less than ideal, emphasize water changes and increase the frequency of feeding. At higher than desired temperatures (for the species), contaminants in the water have a more negative effect and there is decreased digestive efficiency. To get growth, let little ones eat as much as they want as often as they want.

    I don't know if you'll end up of with any Sanke of particular merit, but I think you will end up with one that will be worth pond space as a special remembrance of your 2012 adventure in breeding. That's about all a backyard breeder can hope to achieve.

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