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Thread: Lam's 10,000 US Gallon Formal Raised Koi Pond

  1. #21
    Tategoi hewhoisatpeace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by powerman View Post
    I don't know what to tell you, I have put a 100 micron screen on the cetus sieve and went back to the 300 micron because the 100 micron screen was clogging all the time... it gets a bio film on it further reducing the pore size until the water can't pass through it fast enough and the sieve would be half full of water.... I was having to take it out every couple of days and clean it. I have no algae as this is on the indoor system... this is my experience with them... if yours is working great, that is interesting, but it didn't work for me..
    That is interesting, Dan. Of course, I can't fault your skills, I know they're excellent. I wonder if source water might have something to do with our different results, and if so, what Lam's source water closest compares to. I would guess his is closer to yours than mine, so he might do well to listen better to you, my source water has 0 detectable dissolved solids, even kh and gh are 0. That, I'm sure, is having an effect on everything I'm seeing here.

    I'm not convinced that biofilm formation is what's clogging yours, though. At 2-3 days, biofilm formation is at the stage of proliferation of bacteria, nowhere near thick or dense enough to clog 100 micron slits. I wonder what the clogging agent really is.
    Will Schultze
    (931) 338-6174



  2. #22
    Oyagoi Lam Nguyen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hewhoisatpeace View Post
    That is interesting, Dan. Of course, I can't fault your skills, I know they're excellent. I wonder if source water might have something to do with our different results, and if so, what Lam's source water closest compares to. I would guess his is closer to yours than mine, so he might do well to listen better to you, my source water has 0 detectable dissolved solids, even kh and gh are 0. That, I'm sure, is having an effect on everything I'm seeing here.

    I'm not convinced that biofilm formation is what's clogging yours, though. At 2-3 days, biofilm formation is at the stage of proliferation of bacteria, nowhere near thick or dense enough to clog 100 micron slits. I wonder what the clogging agent really is.
    Will, I will get a water sample from my future neighbor and post test results soon.

  3. #23
    Tosai
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    MultiCyclone

    Having tested the Waterco MultiCyclone for a year in high hopes that this nice unit would be an ultimate solution for fines trapping, I have some conclusions worth sharing.

    The factory MAX flow rate is 132 gpm/7920 gph = great!
    (Note - the manufacturers graph does show faster flow rates does improve results of separating particulates and even tested the flow rate up to 155gpm/9300gph)
    The manufacturer used diatomaceous earth for testing particulate separation and settlement. This is great for pools! Ponds seem to have all different types and sizes of debris floating throughout the water column.

    In my testing, I found I lost only 330 gph when hooked up prior to my bead filter. (Cyclone was mounted directly to out/port on PerformancePro 1/3-56 Pump, going into an Advantage 10 Bead Filter that then flows through Emperor Aquatic 50 Watt UV back to pond water features.)
    System Flow rate: No Cyclone = 3480
    System Flow rate: WITH Cyclone = 3120



    My testing results: Settlement of fines collecting in the clear settling area was very little. It took at least 4 weeks to show perhaps a 1/4 inch of fines in the bottom. I was disappointed.

    Installed the same unit on a different pond with a dial-a-flow pump that concluded with great success once the flow rates were at 5000 gph or higher. The pond water then became more clear of floating debris.

    I have spoken to the Lead Engineer of Waterco USA that makes the Cyclone to see his thoughts. He appreciated my testing and sharing my results and agreed that they suspected for it to perform for ponds, the 5,000 gph is the minimum flow rate. Yet this is not published and so many sites sell them and I cant help but wonder how many pond owners buying them are disappointed.

    Not all ponds are alike and all have different fish loads, foods used, water parameters, climates, exposures to elements, etc., so we all are likely to get different results.

  4. #24
    Tategoi hewhoisatpeace's Avatar
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    Wow, thanks for that insight, Bill. It is different information than I had heard in the past on the MC-50.

  5. #25
    Tategoi powerman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Putnam View Post
    Having tested the Waterco MultiCyclone for a year in high hopes that this nice unit would be an ultimate solution for fines trapping, I have some conclusions worth sharing.

    The factory MAX flow rate is 132 gpm/7920 gph = great!
    (Note - the manufacturers graph does show faster flow rates does improve results of separating particulates and even tested the flow rate up to 155gpm/9300gph)
    The manufacturer used diatomaceous earth for testing particulate separation and settlement. This is great for pools! Ponds seem to have all different types and sizes of debris floating throughout the water column.

    In my testing, I found I lost only 330 gph when hooked up prior to my bead filter. (Cyclone was mounted directly to out/port on PerformancePro 1/3-56 Pump, going into an Advantage 10 Bead Filter that then flows through Emperor Aquatic 50 Watt UV back to pond water features.)
    System Flow rate: No Cyclone = 3480
    System Flow rate: WITH Cyclone = 3120



    My testing results: Settlement of fines collecting in the clear settling area was very little. It took at least 4 weeks to show perhaps a 1/4 inch of fines in the bottom. I was disappointed.

    Installed the same unit on a different pond with a dial-a-flow pump that concluded with great success once the flow rates were at 5000 gph or higher. The pond water then became more clear of floating debris.

    I have spoken to the owner of Waterco that makes the Cyclone to see his thoughts. He appreciated my testing and sharing my results and agreed that they suspected for it to perform for ponds, the 5,000 gph is the minimum flow rate. Yet this is not published and so many sites sell them and I cant help but wonder how many pond owners buying them are disappointed.

    Not all ponds are alike and all have different fish loads, foods used, water pentameters, climates, exposures to elements, etc, so we all are likely to get different results.

    Thanks for posting, Bill.. glad you saw this

  6. #26
    Oyagoi Lam Nguyen's Avatar
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    Thank you Bill for sharing your experience on the MC-50 multicyclone with us. Just out of curiousity, were you able to calculate the power/head loss when you were pumping approx 5k gallons through the MC-50?

    Below is a 8,500 British gallon (approx 10,200 US gallon conversion) pond that Mike Snaden posted on his website Yume Koi:

    http://vimeo.com/moogaloop.swf?clip_...405&autoplay=1

    If I can get my pond half this good then I will be content.
    powerman likes this.

  7. #27
    Oyagoi Lam Nguyen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by creekds View Post
    I was wondering why a S&G filter is so hard to clean??? I just went out to my pond at 5:28 est and completed the cleaning of two 55gal tanks at 5:36. And mostly stood in front of the filters watching the blower do its job. I would have reported earlier but my wife was online shopping for Mother of the Bride dress. So I went out and cleaned the bead filter...........

    I have had the filter in place for two years, and just recently added a bag of grit to each tank, with no other issues ??
    Thanks for sharing. I am starting to think that it really depends on application. I have heard from some that it clogs up very easily and for others it's fine. For me, the S&G will be specifically for water polishing. I don't need the biological component of the S&G filter because the showers, Jmats and fluidized beds will be more than adequate. They will be at the end of the 24-26' longthrow fiilter chamber, so most of the larger solids would have been removed. Hoping that this will make it clog up less. Will see. Still looking for best options for water polishing.
    Last edited by Lam Nguyen; 03-02-2013 at 11:50 AM.

  8. #28
    Tategoi powerman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lam Nguyen View Post
    Thank you Bill for sharing your experience on the MC-50 multicyclone with us. Just out of curiousity, were you able to calculate the power/head loss when you were pumping approx 5k gallons through the MC-50?

    Below is a 8,500 British gallon (approx 10,200 US gallon conversion) pond that Mike Snaden posted on his website Yume Koi:

    http://vimeo.com/moogaloop.swf?clip_...405&autoplay=1

    If I can get my pond half this good then I will be content.

    Great link, Lam, thanks..

  9. #29
    Nisai
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lam Nguyen View Post
    Thanks for sharing. I am starting to think that it really depends on application. I have heard from some that it clogs up very easily and for others it's fine. For me, the S&G will be specifically for water polishing. I don't need the biological component of the S&G filter because the showers, Jmats and fluidized beds will be more than adequate. They will be at the end of the 24-26' longthrow fiilter chamber, so most of the larger solids would have been removed. Hoping that this will make it clog up less. Will see. Still looking for best options for water polishing.
    Lam nguyen I think you bester back out MC50
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Lam's 10,000 US Gallon Formal Raised Koi Pond-image-3-.jpg  

  10. #30
    Oyagoi Lam Nguyen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BAVOTOI View Post
    Lam nguyen I think you bester back out MC50
    I am sorry BAVOTOI, but I don't get what you are saying above. Are you saying I should use or not use MC50? From your attached image, I do see a multicyclone (MC-50 size?) and a couple of bead filters. What is your experience with the MC50?

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