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Thread: Maruju budo koromo evolution

  1. #1
    Tosai Alexandre's Avatar
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    Maruju budo koromo evolution

    Hi guys, I wanted to share with you the evolution of my koromo (50cm 3sai Maruju). I'm wondering if it's turning into a goshiki ? Whatsoever still a cool fish but I recently saw a video of the big female budo koromo oyagoi at maruju koi farm and it's strange because it has goshiki reticulation... My koromo was notorize as a VHQ Ai koromo and from this offspring and now it is turning exactly like this koi : it's becoming a budo with some goshiki pattern ; It's the same for her other sisters that I saw at the original importer. Why did the breeder sell these babies as VHQ Ai koromo (expensive), in addition it's not a pure bloodline?

    Here are some picture you can see many scales getting a blue hue and shadow markings. We don't see it on the photo but the reticulation over the red is pretty good for a budo and the pattern is perfecly balanced.

    Maruju budo koromo evolution-img_1122-xx.jpg Before


    Maruju budo koromo evolution-20170418_171725.jpgAfter
    Maruju budo koromo evolution-20170418_171600.jpg

    Here female oyagoi

    https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https...qAlLEelS0g&s=1

    PS :

    Pond's General Hardness : 8-9°dH

  2. #2
    Jumbo sacicu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alexandre View Post
    Hi guys, I wanted to share with you the evolution of my koromo (50cm 3sai Maruju). I'm wondering if it's turning into a goshiki ? Whatsoever still a cool fish but I recently saw a video of the big female budo koromo oyagoi at maruju koi farm and it's strange because it has goshiki reticulation... My koromo was notorize as a VHQ Ai koromo and from this offspring and now it is turning exactly like this koi : it's becoming a budo with some goshiki pattern ; It's the same for her other sisters that I saw at the original importer. Why did the breeder sell these babies as VHQ Ai koromo (expensive), in addition it's not a pure bloodline?

    Here are some picture you can see many scales getting a blue hue and shadow markings. We don't see it on the photo but the reticulation over the red is pretty good for a budo and the pattern is perfecly balanced.

    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	41314 Before


    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	41315After
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Here female oyagoi

    https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https...qAlLEelS0g&s=1

    PS :

    Pond's General Hardness : 8-9°dH
    I dont see any resemblance of a goshiki. the beni of goshiki is different. It does look like its turning more like a budo goromo with the black over the beni with some spill over sumi. This is probably due to the temperature and high general.hardness.of.your.pond water.

  3. #3
    Jumbo Appliance Guy's Avatar
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    I view the Goromo group as being a koi that is always in transition. The transition often being a wonderful Ai Goromo or Budo Goromo that eventually turns into a Sumi Goromo. Ai (blue), Budo (grape cluster), and Sumi (black) are are just a descriptive term of what the Goromo looks like at that time. They are not seperate sub-varieties that retain their identifying descriptive. So I always expect Goromo to eventually be darker, it's just how will that take. There was a lovely Ai Goromo that repeatedly did well on the US show circuit and I watched her sumi eventually over-run her beni after about five years. I'd consider five years a good run...

    With Goromo, it is the journey to enjoy, not the finish. I wouldn't be disappointed with what you have, it's the nature of the variety.

  4. #4
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
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    The oyagoi is a wonderful koi. What variety label would you attach to her? ... I would describe as a Goromo Goshiki. That is, she is a Goshiki with robing on the Hi. Sometimes folks question why Goshiki and Koromo get combined for judging at many shows because 'they are totally different'. But, they are not totally different. They have been on different paths of refinement, becoming more different. The contemporary trend is to have them in separate judging classes, particularly if the show has enough entries to justify the effort. But, go back to the old books and photos and you can see that there was a high similarity. It was common for Goshiki to have sumi reticulation on the edges of individual scales, making a beautiful sight. The robing of Koromo was less confined to the edge and not as strong. Over time, the ideal of Koromo was a Kohaku with robing limited to the Hi. The ideal of Goshiki became the reverse... a Kohaku with 'robing' on the shiroji. However, when Asagi scalation traits arise in the shiroji we do not call it 'robing'. When we see a young Goshiki today with any sumi arising within the Hi, we tend to criticize the fish as likely to have sumi overrun the Hi. That was not always true. Goshiki with sumi reticulation within the Hi were once held in high regard and the risk of the sumi covering the Hi was a risk folks were willing to take.

    Where things really get confusing is when robing appears in other varieties. The couple of Goromo Sanke I have seen were real messes.... to the point that it took some imagination to see a Sanke under the messy sumi smudges. (Sometimes with Ai Goromo there will be decent sized sumi patches arise worthy of a Sanke. These can be beautiful, but remain labeled as 'Ai Goromo' rather than 'Goromo Sanke'. It's a curious thing how labels get used.) What is much more interesting are Showa. Goromo Showa and Goshiki Showa are labels assigned to koi that appear to be Showa with robing on the Hi (Goromo Showa) or Asagi-type scalation withing the shiroji (Goshiki Showa). Individual specimens can be beautiful with the unusual pigmentation giving them a unique atmosphere.

    A couple of years ago I was at Quality Koi (USA) at harvest time. Mat McCann had once more tried his hand at creating Kin Showa. Among the thousands of small tosai were a couple of non-metallics that were simply different with a grayish body marked with some sumi, motoguro and decent quality Hi. A different sort of patterned Soragoi? Showa whose shiroji was blurred by fading baby sumi? Mat had no idea how they might develop, so he just called them Kawarigoi. I had to have one just to see what would happen. Last summer she grew to about 50cm in my pond. I still have no idea what label to put on her. I think of her as 'Goshiki Showa', but other than the motoguro there is nothing Showa-like about her sumi. It does not wrap. It appears dorsally like on a Sanke, but with blurry edges. And, the ground color is grayish like Goshiki. Altogether, a junk koi, but one so curious that I've grown to like her. My point in mentioning her is to highlight that we tend to want to categorize everything. Breeders have worked to achieve idealized visions of varieties of koi. Their success gives a false impression that everything falls into strict categories. There are many millions of tosai culled every year because they do not fit an ideal. Goshiki and Koromo are still being refined, with the several types of Goshiki progressing very well. (Will each of the types of Goshiki some day be labeled as separate varieties?) Perhaps in time Koromo will be stabilized. Meanwhile, lots to enjoy if a person is able to forget labels for a moment and just see the fish in front of them.

    So... What would you call a Shiro Bekko that had Asagi-like scalation showing blue tones through the shiroji? If it was a Shiro Utsuri, we would label it 'Kage Shiro Utsuri'. These bring good prices when found. Ever seen a Kage Shiro Bekko?

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