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Thread: new pond construction, how's this plan?

  1. #11
    Tosai Charlie_23456's Avatar
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    I would put the falls in the upper left corner or side and the skimmer in the lower right corner or side. That way the prevailing wind and the water help sweep everything to the drains and skimmer. If this is a formal pond, the shape is fine but if you want it to look a bit more natural, an irregular shape would look nice.

  2. #12
    Jumbo Tom C's Avatar
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    The shape of this pond reminds me a little of Tom Lansings pond. Tom's pond is one of the best ponds I have ever seen in person. Let me find a picture of it for you.

  3. #13
    Jumbo Tom C's Avatar
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    Here's a picture of Tom's pond, is it BORING?


  4. #14
    Oyagoi
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    I would worry a little about the circulation going in two directions at once. Also, depending on the trajectory of the waterfall water on teh surface and entry of the pond water, it may just recirculate the same water over and over and leave the further away edges and water dirty.



    I would put the waterfall on one end and the skimmers a complete water circuit away.

  5. #15
    Oyagoi kingkong's Avatar
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    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom C
    The shape of this pond reminds me a little of Tom Lansings pond. Tom's pond is one of the best ponds I have ever seen in person. Let me find a picture of it for you.
    Very well constructed pool with fine materials, an A+. To me, formal pools can be dramatic and are the norm for any proper European garden. To continue this tradition, plan a circular, rectangle or formal pattern as in a Victorian garden for example. We are talking about design and design only here and personal preferences. Form follows function in my book. A pond to me, should be relaxing and planned around the existing topography, a bit of natural beauty on the city dweller's property. A natural pond will seldom be precisly where you think it should be, more of a free form making the surrounding area seem more relaxed as its function, fitting comfortably in the space. Thanks for getting that pic Tom.

    Sunset ideas book "Japanese Gardens" LOL

  6. #16
    Nisai Jules's Avatar
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    A nice oval pool

    1. Skimmers. You can place your skimmers any where on the design as long as you are not running an air dome or 2 as the case may be. However if you turn the air off to the domes on a regular basis i.e. timmer, the skimmers will still work. Look at swimming pools for example they don't have air domes and still work efficiently. Just a thought? I would however place them more towards the outer edge just before the radius on the back wall.

    2. 9' depth. Great in the bottom drain area and goood looking benching all round.

    3. Air domes. with 2 air domes you wil create a section of the pool in the middle where a "dead spot" for floating debris will collect due to the upwards surge from both drains. This however is not a true dead spot as the water will return back to the pool base as long as the air dome is running. Your returns need not be angled when you employ air domes as the principle of angling the water down wards is redundant when air domes are emplyoed due to the sweeping of the bottom as water in drawn in and vertical lift of the air creating uplift.

    4. Mid water intakes. Why? feed off the skimmer. Certkin/Astral flap weir skimmers have a 1.5 inch and 2 inch bsp female thread you could run 3kgph off one of these units. I have had a Badu Top 8 running mine for 5 years now, Bearings have gone and have just replaced it with a Red Devil.

    5. Under water lights. Be prepared to see you koi swim on their sides untill
    they get used to them and also every few days you will need to cleen the algae from them as it naturaly will build up and cover the lens.

    6, Windows. You do not need a stainless frame for a window. It is very easy and safe to do it with out. Materials required are the same as a window with a frame. Concrete lintel for internal course of brick/block work. Steel L lintel for external brick work. The upper edges of the window will be your bricks retuned back to the "window" to give you a nice internal fininish in the hole. The bottom frame is another course of bricks or a ledge of granite/marble shelving. The inside ofthe window frame is fitted out with a timber frame leveled and rendered up to. Fibreglassed/gunite with an extra layer and then silicone the window in with a bead of 10mm - 15mm and press the glass against. You will need to hold the glass in place till the silicone takes. Depending on which silicone used (obviously aqautic use only silicone) will depend on the cure time. If you need any pictures of this method drop me an email.

    7. Filters. The 2 Nexus will be on the "upper limits" of the manafacturers recommendation but will actualy cope with your pool. If you were using the skimmers to feed a seperate fitration system like a Bakki shpwer which inturn would feed your water fall I think your system would be ace.

    Nice size pool and I hope this helps?

    Jules

  7. #17
    Oyagoi
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    The two concerns I have with your nice design are-

    1-The circulation factor, with your skimmers that close to your water fall (the only return I see there), it will simply recirculate the same water over and over while the water in the ends and further from the wtaerfall will get very little circulation. You will get better recirculation and thus filtration of you move them to the ends, or move the waterfall to the end and create one large circular motion that is the same direction the winds tend to create. You can use your returns to create that motion. You need to worry about the circulation both up and down and circular (side to side). With your current design one side of the pond will be fighting the natural circulation direction created by the bottom drains, and the wind.

    2-Placing the steps under the waterfall, the up and down circular motion the waterfall creates to sweep waste to the bds and aid the penetration of oxygenated water to the depths of the pool will be interrupted. You might think about moving the steps down to where one of the skimmers is.

    I personally would not try to fight the natural flow, let it work for you. If teh aesthetics of a mid pond placed waterfall are what works, then simply place the skimmers on the ends of the pond. Placing them so close to the waterfall will create 'short cycling', the same water over and over while the remaining portions of the pond are too still.

    Where will the main sitting and viewing areas be too? You want to build it so the koi will naturaly hang out in your full view. Most of the time that is under the waterfall.

  8. #18
    Nisai
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    Based on my calculation, the gallonage is a touch over 11K when filled to the brim (8 feet at the edge). If the planned water level is about 10 inches below, then Flounder correctly stated his project a 10K gallon pond. The raceway shape is ideal for water mix and waste evacuation, another plus.

    Each Nexus (model #300, the large version) supports 3,200 gph throughput and that is the limitation of the Answer. With two additional skimmers (types?), the turnover rate is approaching 1 hour potentially! I've seen 4 successful ponds with 2 hr turnover rate and that is a general concensus for a reasonable stock pond. Some hobbyists like faster turnover of 1.5 hr or lower for safety when design a large pond. A small pond or Qtank should have 1.5 hr or faster turnover. At the other extreme, the INDOOR BH system recommended a 45-minute turnover rate plus 10% daily water change! The efficiency of mechanical/biofilter design, stoking rate and feeding habit are also part of a succeful pond.

    But then, why invest all your bio to the dynamic media Nexus? How about buit-in settling + Matala > Jmats > lift pumps? cheap, stable and effient in one circuit. TT/bakki as others suggested?. I read somewhere on the net about an ultimate filter described as dynamic media (Nexus/bioreactor) in the bottom part and TT directly above. The gas/air that drives the boiling action of K1 below also drives the TT's efficiency through the roof! Talking about one shot for two koi here, a bio filter that is both compact and powerful?

    The combination of different bio filtrations complement each others through the seasons and, hopefully, the synergy of that combined strength? MA Le

  9. #19
    Oyagoi Flounder's Avatar
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    Thank you for all your opinions on the design of this pond. I want to address a couple of replies. I want a formal pond so the shape of it will work for my landscaping. I have already aquired the filtration systems so I'm going to use what I have now in this design. The waterfall is located where it can be viewed from the house.

    What are your thoughts if I were to move the skimmers to the northwest and northeast side of the pond? I was told that you shouldn't locate the skimmer where it may break the flow of the TPRs, ie the southwest, southeast or south side near the window. The desire is to have the water flow in an almost complete circle from the return (waterfall and TPRs) to the outlet (skimmers and mid water return).

    BTW mynamy1 is right, I have calculated the volume of this design many times and it almost always ends up a little over 10K gallons.

  10. #20
    Daihonmei PapaBear's Avatar
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    I like the overall concept and the aesthetic considerations are obviously important, but the existing setup leaves a dead spot in front of the window that will likely accumulate detrius in the least desirable place . If the tpr's you have flanking the window were moved above and below it instead it might sweep that problem away.
    There is still the issue of the waterfall outlet simply making a short curcuit on the surface straight back to the skimmers unless you move them further away toward the ends.

    Quote Originally Posted by Flounder
    Thank you for all your opinions on the design of this pond. I want to address a couple of replies. I want a formal pond so the shape of it will work for my landscaping. I have already aquired the filtration systems so I'm going to use what I have now in this design. The waterfall is located where it can be viewed from the house.

    What are your thoughts if I were to move the skimmers to the northwest and northeast side of the pond? I was told that you shouldn't locate the skimmer where it may break the flow of the TPRs, ie the southwest, southeast or south side near the window. The desire is to have the water flow in an almost complete circle from the return (waterfall and TPRs) to the outlet (skimmers and mid water return).

    BTW mynamy1 is right, I have calculated the volume of this design many times and it almost always ends up a little over 10K gallons.

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