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Thread: Question in regards to Domestic Koi...

  1. #21
    Jumbo
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    Perspective,...

    JR, Aquitori, and other Koi nuts,... how many 30" + high quality show Koi exist in the entire United States? Total from Japan or any other country.

    Another question,... out of these 30"+ Show Koi in the US, how many different breeders were responsible for producing them?

    In those two answers will be just an idea of how difficult an accomplishment a 30" Koi is.

    A little perspective.

    Best Wishes,
    Brady Brandwood
    Last edited by Brady Brandwood; 12-30-2005 at 09:34 PM. Reason: Type-o

  2. #22
    Oyagoi koifishgirl's Avatar
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    Excuse me for asking but what the heck is a Gosanke, I keep think a Sanke on the Go

  3. #23
    Daihonmei aquitori's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brady Brandwood
    JR, Aquitori, and other Koi nuts,... how many 30" + high quality show Koi exist in the entire United States? Total from Japan or any other country.

    Another question,... out of these 30"+ Show Koi in the US, how many different breeders were responsible for producing them?

    In those two answers will be just an idea of how difficult an accomplishment a 30" Koi is.

    A little perspective.

    Best Wishes,
    Brady Brandwood
    Brady how many fish do you produce each season? Out of what you produce how many are left back to grow on?

  4. #24
    Daihonmei
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    Gosanke is composed of the three varieties, Kohaku, sanke, and Showa.
    Most agree that the term was used to describe three "king/emperor/samurai types that were famous and grouped together for some reason....
    Sanke, Showa, and Kohaku are the BIG Three varieties...similar to the original Gosanke(Big three) Rulers.
    now that reasoning might be wrong....but the Gosanke Group is Kohaku sanke and showa

  5. #25
    Honmei Brutuscz's Avatar
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    These are a couple of my american koi. The beni kumonryu is 12-13". The ki utsuri and ginrin sanke are each 10-12"..but growing very quickly. About 1" per month. They are all from blackwater creek. The others are under 10". I'll show you them in the future...when they are huge. I cannot capture the quality of the ginrin sanke on film..but it is one of my favorites. Probably from suda bloodlines, as are many from blackwater (suda is part owner..or something like that.) Feel free to comment on them.

  6. #26
    Oyagoi koifishgirl's Avatar
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    Ask me this same question in about 3 years, by then I should have some 30 inchers

  7. #27
    Jumbo Tom C's Avatar
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    Joe,...Pamela Anderson or Jessica Alba? Which one?
    Boy that is a easy one for me. I delivered to her many times, have you seen Pamela Anderson in person and close up? If you have, you will see all the cracks in her make-up. That girl seems to be hiding something under all of that make-up, but she sure does smell good.


    Since we are talking about domestic, how many people on this board have some? I have one in my pond, it looks better then some of the small imports that I have got from Japan.

    Is having high quality import koi like having something Tom Lee's has? Does it make us better then the next person? Why would all of this matter, if we are just hobbyist enjoying the hobby?

    How many hobbyist show koi? I would say it's a lot less than 1% of the hobbyist. Can a domestic do well in a show? I would say it all comes down to the show it's in.

    What gets me is we talk about how great import breeders are. As a lot of us know those koi were not even bred by that breeder. It's well known that breeders buy koi from other breeders in Japan and sell them as their own. How many domestic breeders do this?

    Keep it simple, keep it straight Koi-Bito.com

  8. #28
    Jumbo Tom C's Avatar
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    JR, Aquitori, and other Koi nuts,... how many 30" + high quality show Koi exist in the entire United States? Total from Japan or any other country.

    Another question,... out of these 30"+ Show Koi in the US, how many different breeders were responsible for producing them?

    In those two answers will be just an idea of how difficult an accomplishment a 30" Koi is.

    A little perspective.

    Best Wishes,
    Brady Brandwood
    Brady these are some great questions. I have been to a few high end hobbyist houses and I don't remember seeing any 30"+ gosankes in any of the pond. Let see did Tom B have any in his, NOPE. Did Tom L have any in his, Nope. Did Steve C have any in his, Nope. Did Bert B have any in his, Nope. Did Nancy and Frank have any in theirs, I don't remember seeing any 30"+ in thiers. Well they have one that might be close to 30"+. I don't remember seeing any gosankes that size in any ponds I have seen. Between these people I'm sure their is over 20 GC koi that are all less than 30".

  9. #29
    Jumbo B.Scott's Avatar
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    Tom you are passing up the question. It isn't a matter of whether or not you show your koi or have koi of show quality. The question is whether or not domestic breeders in the US and Europe are capable of producing such fish. Lets face it, 99.9% of all Japanese koi sold are cast-offs. If you see a fish outside of Japan it is almost certainly tatashita despite the sign to the contrary above the tank.The amount of money that these tatashita bring a dealer are never enough to sustain an industry. I'm willing to bet that the remaining 0.1% of Tatagoi remaining have a value far exceeding the other 99.9%. I believe that for a breeder to survive in the long run it is essential that a small portion of his fish are of top quality. The higher that portion is the better the breeders chances of survival are. Talk to Brett Rowley... Most of the fish he produces are sold by the pound as bass-bait. Not enough to keep him afloat by any means.
    Being able to produce high end koi as well as the unenviable cast-offs is a sign of the breeders prowess and ability to pick and choose which fish are going to develop the desired traits and which younger fish have the potential to do so. It shows his understanding of how to choose the best match in parent fish and in the long run elevates the quality of all the fish produced, even the cheaper ones in the ponds of the average hobbyist.


    B.Scott
    Semper in excreta, sumus solum profundum variat

  10. #30
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
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    Brady: I think there are at least a handful, produced by a two-finger pinch of Japanese breeders. And that's a lot more than there were 7 years ago. ..... Ya still got time.

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