Home | About Us | Contact Us


Koi Forum - Koi-Bito Magazine straight from Japan
Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 40

Thread: The Importance of Motoguro

  1. #1
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Orlando, Florida
    Posts
    11,128

    The Importance of Motoguro

    Here is a Shiro Utsuri I find of interest, but instead of motoguro, she has a few broad stripes in the pectorals. With motoguro, I think this could be a stunning koi as an adult. Without motoguro, her future is cloudy. In judging koi the presence of motoguro is not of overarching importance; but, like pattern generally, it can make a world of difference in grabbing the eye. In the pond, perhaps even more so. ....Just some rambling thoughts. Comments?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails The Importance of Motoguro-omosakoshiro-6.jpg   The Importance of Motoguro-omosako-6-4.jpg   The Importance of Motoguro-omosakoshiro-6fin1.jpg   The Importance of Motoguro-omosakoshiro-6fin2.jpg  

  2. #2
    Honmei KoiCop's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    3,774

    MikeM . . .

    some very interesting observations on motoguru.

    Hopefully, someone else can teach us about this from a judge's perspective -- but I tend to find the koi incomplete without it.

  3. #3
    Daihonmei dick benbow's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    seattle, wa
    Posts
    6,340
    I have seen in large high class competitive shows, showa or shiro without any on each pec or just one on one side picked as winners. So if the koi has what else it takes it can overcome.....a minor shortage here and there

    To me this fish from a technical standpoint has motoguru on both pecs. Is it a pefect fanlike one, no but I don't think it detracts from the koi and i like the koi myself as well.

    there was a time a decade ago when i had the chance to buy a first class shintaro showa that had motoguru on just one side. I passed, was probably the dumbest decision I ever made as the rest of the koi was stirling.....

    truthfully....whether visitors like the koi or a cluster of judges...it's only for a short time...the rest of the year it's if you like the koi that matters. To me it's like the 2 cm tail stop rule on kohaku, nice if it's there but you can still win without it....

  4. #4
    Oyagoi RayJordan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    San Antonio, Texas
    Posts
    1,780
    I agree with Dick. It is really not that uncommon for showas and shiro utsuris to have striped fins. This is a throw back to their earlier genetics when showas and Utsuris were supposed to have striped fins. Today nearly all Hi Utsuri are the old type with striped fins. Most showa and utsuri with striped fins seem to also have the flatter brownish type of old style sumi but not all.

    Personally it used to be more important to me for a showa or shiro utsuri to have good motoguro. I have started to focus more on the whole package especially body conformation, quality of color especially white with showa and their recent decendants Shiro Utsuri. It still boils down to how powerful and impressive these koi with body wrapping sumi appear.

  5. #5
    Daihonmei aquitori's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    NorCal Biotch!!!
    Posts
    9,133
    Weather the fish has motoguro or not depends on the finish of the body pattern. There have been fish with no motoguro do well at shows. The fish is far from finished, and I think it is way to early for concerns.

  6. #6
    Oyagoi Sangreaal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Northern California
    Posts
    1,829
    Well, let's see some pics of motoguro, good and bad and in between. Here's about the only example of what I think of as good motoguro in my own pond. This is Shiia, my 10-11" GR showa:



    Her motoguro is the same both sides.

    Marie

  7. #7
    Oyagoi koiczar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    2,352
    MikeM

    Something I was taught many years ago, and it's nothing new to most, but looking at your shiro, you have a fish that you're going to enjoy for several years to come. Sumi, as I'm sure you know, develops from the tail to the head (usually). Looking at the motoguro and the hachiware pattern developing slowly on the head, it tells me that this fish is far from finished. My best guess estimate would be another 2 years. The sumi will thicken this winter in cooler temps, but still drop off for one more growing season. After that, look out!! I think it will set in the winter of 2007 and become one incredible fish for spring 2008. At this point I'll wager a guess that she is sansai - is that right?! Never the less, enjoy the journey and keep us updated with pics each 6 months on this one. Personally, I would really enjoy the show

    Thanks

    Mike

  8. #8
    Fry
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    2

    Thumbs up fish artist

    Quote Originally Posted by koiczar View Post
    MikeM

    Something I was taught many years ago, and it's nothing new to most, but looking at your shiro, you have a fish that you're going to enjoy for several years to come. Sumi, as I'm sure you know, develops from the tail to the head (usually). Looking at the motoguro and the hachiware pattern developing slowly on the head, it tells me that this fish is far from finished. My best guess estimate would be another 2 years. The sumi will thicken this winter in cooler temps, but still drop off for one more growing season. After that, look out!! I think it will set in the winter of 2007 and become one incredible fish for spring 2008. At this point I'll wager a guess that she is sansai - is that right?! Never the less, enjoy the journey and keep us updated with pics each 6 months on this one. Personally, I would really enjoy the show

    Thanks

    Mike

    i am new mike ,thanks for your insight into the pattern changes .it gives me an idea as to when one of my koi will develope.i am also troubled with several koi picking up the yellow in the head reigon. especially kohako. i have a new suda kohako ,the skin was pure white ,very silky,just beautiful,however ,since i started feeding medi carp,tetra viberance and wheatgerm mixture ,the color changed. very rapidly the yellow emerged in the head reigon. i live in south florida, the water is as you can imagine quite warm. what food should in your opinion feed the koi to prevent the yellowing if possible. i suppose the yellow will diminish in cooler water and if fed an absence of color inhancers. am i correct. my pond is about 5000 gal max 4 ft deep .

    thanks fish artist

  9. #9
    Fry
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    2

    Thumbs up importance of motoguro

    Quote Originally Posted by RayJordan View Post
    I agree with Dick. It is really not that uncommon for showas and shiro utsuris to have striped fins. This is a throw back to their earlier genetics when showas and Utsuris were supposed to have striped fins. Today nearly all Hi Utsuri are the old type with striped fins. Most showa and utsuri with striped fins seem to also have the flatter brownish type of old style sumi but not all.

    Personally it used to be more important to me for a showa or shiro utsuri to have good motoguro. I have started to focus more on the whole package especially body conformation, quality of color especially white with showa and their recent decendants Shiro Utsuri. It still boils down to how powerful and impressive these koi with body wrapping sumi appear.
    this is fish artist, i totaly agree. the overall appearance is what counts. however i go for the motoguro in showa. i think it is like jewelry it dresses the overall appearence. thanks fish artist

  10. #10
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Orlando, Florida
    Posts
    11,128
    Some interesting comments so far.

    Koiczar: Not mine (yet, anyway ). She is right at 20". In her third season, but the third season was in a holding tank, not a mud pond. So, not as well developed as she might be. Yes, the pattern is striking. If I do get her, I think her name will be Hebi... "serpent". I think I see a forked tongue rising on her face. The snake has an interesting place in folklore as both a sign of the sinister and a sign of good fortune and prosperity. When it rained, the snakes would come indoors to stay dry, the crops would flourish and the mice eating the stored food would disappear. I cannot quite make up my mind whether this karasuhebi is the sinister sort or the bringer of good luck.

    Dick: Interesting point. I guess she does technically have motoguro. But you've hit on the real question... If she gives enjoyment now, will it matter in three years or five? What I find curious about this Shiro is that the "atmosphere" has a lot of Bekko in it, but I can't quite put my finger on it. Maybe it is the absence of the blocks of Sumi we generally see on Shiros. And the pattern is more dorsal. The absence of the "full fan" motoguro adds to the Bekko "atmosphere", I think.

Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 09-22-2012, 02:03 PM
  2. Importance of pattern on show koi.
    By Erns in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 37
    Last Post: 10-12-2010, 12:36 PM
  3. Motoguro experiment thread
    By jnorth in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 41
    Last Post: 11-01-2007, 12:57 PM
  4. Motoguro
    By l113892 in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 10-11-2006, 11:13 AM
  5. Shiro utsuri- motoguro
    By l113892 in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 01-30-2006, 10:37 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Articles - Sitemap - FAQs and Rules

KB Footer Graphic
Straight from Japan... For the serious hobbyist!
All content and images copyright of: Koi-bito.com