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Thread: No need water change??

  1. #1
    Nisai
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
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    146

    No need water change??

    Hello,

    My dealer is advocating that there is no need to do any water changes to my pond. He says he will adjust a constant flow of fresh water into the pond very slowly and it will overflow by itself all in very minute amounts. There is also no need to add any anti chlorine as the amount that enters the filter will in the end dissipate by itself.

    He does not say that this is better but it is ok. He is a Momotaro dealer and has thousands of koi's all using this method. In fact he has a gigantic pond that houses many jumbo koi's and they seem to be thriving and happily playing in the pond which also uses the same method. this has been going on for many years already.

    I told him that i still prefer to do water changes once a week and he says that is ok maybe slightly better only.

    Please give your honest comment on how a system like that could possibly work or if it works at all.

    Mingaun

  2. #2
    Jumbo
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    999
    Your dealer is not wrong and it shall be an ideal situation for koi as long as we can maintain a good water quality.....

  3. #3
    Nisai
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
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    146
    Thanks Super Kindai

    I feel he is not wrong, in fact we are striking a good relationship at the moment and he seems honest enough. His koi's speaks volume though.

    Is this a common practice?

    Mingaun
    Last edited by mingaun; 02-29-2008 at 08:51 PM. Reason: spelling

  4. #4
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
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    Dec 2003
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    Orlando, Florida
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    The constant flow is better than a water change, if as much fresh water is added over the period of time involved, because it better assures stable conditions. However, the rate at which chlorine dissipates through volatilization varies greatly according to water parameters. In hard water the chlorine can remain in the water for weeks. (There are stabilizers available at pool supply shops just for this purpose... to minimize the need to add chlorine to the swimming pool.) Of course, it does not remain in a pond... it acts on all organic matter and is thereby eliminated. That is not good. It may well be that your dealer and many of his customers have not observed a problem. That does not mean there is no degradation of gill filaments over time, nor does it mean that the same lack of observable effects would occur in your water. It is not too difficult to add auto dosing equipment to dechlorinate the fresh water as it is added. Or, you can add ST in an appropriate amount daily. It will remain active for 24 hours (or even longer) in most pond conditions. BTW, in the interest of full disclosure, you should know that I am very biased against all oxidative additives being used in a pond at any time. Some would say that I can get a bit extreme on the subject.
    Last edited by MikeM; 02-29-2008 at 09:10 PM. Reason: typo

  5. #5
    Nisai
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    Feb 2008
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    Is there a chlorine test that can be done? What levels would start to harm the gills of the fish?

    Mingaun

  6. #6
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
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    Dec 2003
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    Chlorine test kits are available. IMO, no chlorine should ever be detectable in the pond.

  7. #7
    Nisai
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
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    Thanks Mike. I feel much more reassured now

  8. #8
    Tosai
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Naples FL
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    29
    Why not add a carbon filter on your source water? Depending on the volume of water you are using you can get up to a year before a change is needed.

    Another good practice is to use a very low volume fogger/ spay nozzle and spray the water onto the surface of the pond. These work great for gassing off Chlorine and CO2.

    I believe a slow trickle is the best possible thing for any pond. It really helps to stabilize the water chemistry.

  9. #9
    Daihonmei
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    7,642
    Bingo! The idea is not wrong and it 'can' actually be a superior way to keep koi. But ONLY if you are highly confident about your water. I would, as suggested definitely use a treatment filter and also maintain/ service it regularly. I would also aerate that treated water before it enters the pond.
    I would actually suggest it be allowed to enter- not in the pond directly, but rather in a sump with an over flow. This has a double benefit of flushing the sump that has a stand pipe and also to condition the water a little further as it passes the filter. The only caveat here, however- your biofilter must be aerated ( a bakki would be ideal) so that raw water is further oxygenated and so that the raw water is not allowed to effect the biofilm too much. In otherwords, the amount of raw water should not be more than 20% of the water volume passing through the biofilter as you want a dilution factor but also not short change the turn over rate of your ammonia laden water. Understand? JR

  10. #10
    Oyagoi Eugeneg's Avatar
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    He does not say that this is better but it is ok. He is a Momotaro dealer and has thousands of koi's all using this method. In fact he has a gigantic pond that houses many jumbo koi's and they seem to be thriving and happily playing in the pond which also uses the same method. this has been going on for many years already.

    It sounds as though you have a dealer that can advise you well so I would go by what he recommends as he would have a better grasp of the situation being close by .
    Sounds as though you can start at a higher level than most hobists . You can then progress to nisai which are generally higher quality as I think that fish need at least one year in mud pond more time is better . I prefer to have small water flow going in rather than water changes
    Regards
    Eugene

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