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Thread: Nishikigoi and artificial light

  1. #1
    Sansai Vogata's Avatar
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    Nishikigoi and artificial light

    Hello I’m just wondering if any of you have some recommendations or no some places where the light need of Nishikigoi is documented or discussed in a reliable way. I’m also thankful for good old wisdom of trail and error contenders like yours truly.

    We have built some systems now and have by trail and error on our own systems (indoor) found numbers that we have fait in and that the Nishikigoi and water (filter activity) reacts well on.
    The tube is full spectrum natural light wit some addition in the low (blue) side. It will for the more ordinary of us feel like looking on the sun, but milder, still awfully bright some will say. Indoor we have been in the e1.5-1.8m depth range that suits the functioning are of the tubes well as they fall dramatically on ~1.5 m distance.
    The waterproofed light system is on timers and dimmers for natural daylight simulation (almost but often a tad faster). We have establishes a regime on ~ 60 pr square meter (~10.76 square foot) surface and are more than curious of the board’s reactions and thought around this often forgotten aspect of indoor winter facilities for Nishikigoi.
    Tone - Truls -Petter
    Vogata NI

  2. #2
    Sansai Vogata's Avatar
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    Hello no light bulbs going of in the Wally of Nishikigoi?

    Is it only us cold northerners that has the need for proper light during our “short winter periods? We really would enjoy thoughts and other experiences on this, to little and the metabolism, utilising of nutrients and colour goes down the drain. Too much well to much is just no good anyway and we doubt that it can be healthy to us or them.

  3. #3
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
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    Some of the folks who winter their koi indoors might have suggestions of what works for them. We do know that koi with exposure to sunlight develop better color, but that direct sun can be harmful. Bright shade seems best. I think a selection of artificial light that imitates the intensity of the shady side of a house would be about right. I am not familiar with studies of light color and the like in relation to fish development. But, I don't think you can go wrong using a full-spectrum daylight flourescent[I am familiar with such studies relating to the needs of aquatic plants. There are spectra that are optimal for different processes, but the differences between a 'natural daylight' flourescent, a bluish-light, a greenish light, yellow etc. are really not so great.] The real challenge in aquarium lighting is having the bulbs close enough to get appropriate intensity, without undue risk or over heating the water. Just some thoughts while we wait for those who have experience in keeping koi under lights.

  4. #4
    Fry
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    Thanks for the information

    hello there,
    Thanks for the information. this question and answers regarding this made me filled up many informations and new knowledge. keep up good work.
    Last edited by jnorth; 05-11-2008 at 03:45 PM. Reason: removed advertising

  5. #5
    Sansai Vogata's Avatar
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    In the wait on the masters – some more background

    Attached should be the spectrum on our chosen luminaries at 10 000K. This is the one we felt gave the best result even with limited possibility for broad testing we have some thoughts around it. pdf

    Start was a functioning 12 ton winter system and lack of anything resembling summer. The Kichi always wonder so we decided to se if we could turn it around. With old baggage and what little was out there we decided to improve lighting and heating. Heating was easy, thermostat, exchanger and some reading – done.
    Light well a different story all together, after a coupler of years with trail and “not so good as expected” we landed on:
    10 000K luminary at ~56W and 3680 EM (Lm) per square meter.

    As our ability to evaluate Nishikigoi development and knowledge of gen pool for each on is and still are somewhat limited we had to look at different aspects an they where. How did the Nishikigoi react, it was pleasing with better apatite and more activity (almost to much, oops indoors).
    Water quality was steady going upwards, life and alga in pond and filter went from almost not existing to thriving and everywhere. Water quality was at current level stabile and pleasing the Nishikigoi are thriving (should really have more space but for us that’s an “always”). It has been pleasing and to the best of our ability good for four years now even if the basement looks like an illegal “farm” from the outside now days. We have seen no downside at this moment.

    We have this winter taken it a step further and open indoor II, but just a 7 ton system her with:
    10 000K luminary at ~68W and 4470 EM (Lm) per square meter.
    As you can see even a bit “lighter”.

    Hope that this information can be helpful for some and help the more knowledgeable out on the board to help us make it better.
    Please feel free to jump in and trash the system – rebuild area fun.

  6. #6
    Sansai Vogata's Avatar
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    Trying the pdf again

    Hope its there now
    Attached Files Attached Files

  7. #7
    Sansai Vogata's Avatar
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    Nobody?

    Well I promise that this is my last ”bump”, but tare there really no thoughts floating around on artificial light and Nishikigoi or our approach to it?

  8. #8
    Jumbo
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    Hubby and I keep all our koi indoors from around the end of October through middle of May. We live in Minnesota. Winter is simply too harsh to chance loosing any of the fish to our winters. Two years ago I added simple shop lighting fixturs (4 of them holding 2 bulbs each). suspended about 8-10 inches above the top of our holding tanks. We use a rather inexpensive broad spectrum bulbs that I purchase at Menards. The light must penatrate a plastic opeque cover as well. They are all on a timer which goes on about 7:00 am and off again around 11:00 at night. Since adding this lighting I've noticed a marked improvement compared to prior years without them. Colors are holding well. I notice is most with out Kin Ki Utsuri. Her sumi would totally go to gray once inside, but return thick and black when released again outdoors each spring. With the lights added, this does not happen anymore. My Gosanke hold their reds well also. I can't remember the lumins for each bulb, but will try to get that information in the next few days.
    2010 Upper Midwest Koi Club Show
    AKCA 4th Annual Open Show
    July 31st, Aug 1st & 2nd, Minneapolis, MN
    http://www.umkoiclub.org/

  9. #9
    Daihonmei dick benbow's Avatar
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    I don't think I've ever seen a scientific documented sheet on what your asking.

    I do know that if kept indoors without speciallty bulbs to replace the natural sunlight, the koi's color and skin suffers. It is particularly noticeable in young koi, who can be easily
    damaged in their ability to fully develop their color.

    Those closet to the equator have to deal with extremes of sun and most outdoor ponds have to have sun shade provided or they can actually get burnt with our cystal clear water......

    There is a reason why so many japanese breeders are building greenhouses to emitt more light as their koi are held during the winter
    Dick Benbow

  10. #10
    Sansai Vogata's Avatar
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    Strange

    I know that the "sunburn" problem has been addressed, but I thought Nishikigoi now was so spread over the world that there would be lots of people with similar lack of light problems as us. Maybe not as funny as here, but still.

    The reason I posted is just as you mentioned lack of sources with viable information. I was betting on some “known” Breeders (outside Japan), you and JR. I cant help but feeling that this should be an issue In the Northern States, UK, Germany ……. and along that general line across the boarders.

    Feedback has been somewhat dazzling so far and we have nothing, but our own unscientific numbers and data. Better than noting but still

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