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Thread: Spring fed mudpond with liner

  1. #1
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    Spring fed mudpond with liner

    Right now I have access to a rice field, it's spring fed but the mud/clay drains and dries up the water quickly. Thus, the rice field only holds about 1' of water. What if I dig up the rice field and put plastic liner in it so that the water will drain slower, thus a deeper pond and no more rice field. I was going to go cheap and use Heavy 6mil plastic from homedepot 20x100 and put it over the dug out pond. Maybe dig about 4', put the plastic in, and then add 1.5' of mud. The idea is to still have a mud pond put to make it deeper and for the water to drain less. If the pond don't drain quickly, the water should be around 4-5' deep. The rice field is currently 40'x50'x1'. Also, I put some frys in the rice field and they are still alive.



    In short: what do you think about putting mud in a liner pond but it is a flow through system. Mountain spring fed. I want to achieve a mud pond.

  2. #2
    Oyagoi CarolinaGirl's Avatar
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    First of all, don't even think of wasting time and money using 6 mil plastic from lowes. It has no UV resistance, no resistance to puncture and it is totally unsuitable for the job. If you want a liner that will last, look into the large basin liners. I think Growers Supply sells them. Secondly, you won't have a mud pond if you line it....you will have a liner pond that has a whole pile of organics in it. It's not the same. A koi pond has to be emptied out and clean every so often and that is a huge job that requires heavy equipment. And not one that can be done if you have a liner of any kind buried under a little mud. Plus, if it's spring fed, how is the water supposed to still get in and out if you drop a liner in it? If you have the pond and have access to the equipment, consider reworking the pond as it is and getting it sealed up with clay.

  3. #3
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    Question More help

    The purpose of the liner is to slow down the water drainage, not to hold the water. I was planning to burry the 6mill 1 or 2' below the mud. The plastic will not be taped or glued together, just burry. So I would overlap the 20x100' 1 or 2 times and then add mud after I dig it up some. The spring comes from above and the pond sits below. It's a rice field so it is design to grow rice and have water flow in it. However, I want to convert one into a mud pond for koi (fry/tosai/nisai growout). I do not want to put in a heavy liner and make a liner pond, but a mud pond.

    If clay is the best way to do it, what clay do I use? Bentonite? The rice fields are in NC and the clay is red. Should I just start digging and hope that the clay below will hold the water? That was the original plan, but the revise one was to put in some plastic to help it hold water.

    Right now, the rice field holds about 1’ of water and then drains to the next field then next. It is built on tiers. But I want to convert the first field for koi keeping and flow the rest of the water to the other rice field.

    Thanks in advance
    kc

  4. #4
    Honmei ricshaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chang26k View Post
    The purpose of the liner is to slow down the water drainage, not to hold the water. I was planning to burry the 6mill 1 or 2' below the mud. The plastic will not be taped or glued together, just burry. So I would overlap the 20x100' 1 or 2 times and then add mud after I dig it up some. The spring comes from above and the pond sits below. It's a rice field so it is design to grow rice and have water flow in it. However, I want to convert one into a mud pond for koi (fry/tosai/nisai growout). I do not want to put in a heavy liner and make a liner pond, but a mud pond.

    If clay is the best way to do it, what clay do I use? Bentonite? The rice fields are in NC and the clay is red. Should I just start digging and hope that the clay below will hold the water? That was the original plan, but the revise one was to put in some plastic to help it hold water.

    Right now, the rice field holds about 1’ of water and then drains to the next field then next. It is built on tiers. But I want to convert the first field for koi keeping and flow the rest of the water to the other rice field.

    Thanks in advance
    kc
    I think you need to talk to a pro. Somebody in your area familiar with aquaculture and mud ponds.
    I have read about things people add to mud pond bottoms before they fill them with water.

  5. #5
    Oyagoi CarolinaGirl's Avatar
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    ricshaw's advise is good.....talk to a pro. The plastic won't really slow down the leaking, it will just redirect the leaking to the joints. The plastic will be a total waste of money and effort.

  6. #6
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    New Plan

    How about line the 60'x80'x5' pond with 20 mil, then add 1' of mud....

    or break the 60x80 into 15'x40' and line it.. then add 1' of mud...

    or... non of you like the liner with mud and want me to put clay in it...

    there are lots of sandy parts to this rice field and the water will drain within 4-7 days... depends on the weather. The small stream only has water if it is raining or not very hot... I can put a 5000gph pump in a 10'x4' wide stream that is next to the rice field but I would rather have a pond that don't leak...
    oh and my test in summer of 2010... I threw 300 frys (not even 1/2") in the rice patty and most of them became 3" thick... but only 5-7" long. Color were mutts but very vibe and there was no way of catching them because of the rice.... So I am using 1 rice patty for raising koi this summer. it's 80x80 but after digging making walls/slopes it will be more like a 60'x60' but would rather break it down into 3 or 4 rows. I really like the plan of 15x40x(3-5) and make 2 of them this year.... then carry on next year...


    and last but not least... line it with no mud in it....

    and I plan to only raise frys-tosai in it until Sept Oct, or Nov...

    And I am only going to use two sets of koi...
    1 would be (female)magoiXkohahu (don't have the kohaku yet)
    2 would be (female)hiutsuriXhiutsuri both butterfly and don't yet have these

    #1 spawn would be culled 3-4 times before sept.
    #2 spawn would be culled 2-? times before sept as these will be what supports my hobby. Hoping to get a few showa bla bla bla...
    and the main thing I want is to get a few good kohaku and going for 1000 gallons of water per # of fish so maybe 150 by the end of 4th cull, for the kohaku anyway... so about 1 kohaku or koi per 1000 gallon
    the butterfly will get atlease 300-700 gallon per fish, maybe 500 by the last cull

    and I plan on raising by best (20-50 kohaku, 10-20 butterfly) over winter and convert 1 15x40 into a greenhouse type by putting plastic over.

    Don't know where I am going to put the oyagoi... maybe build them a small mud pond?

    and all the culls are going into the rice (about 4 100x120' and 3 80x80) field for the family to have fun with.

    but what about the mud.
    What i'm thinking, with a very low stocking rate, the mud in the liner should be fine because of the very low stocking rate....at least for the kohaku
    If the butterfly becomes a problem... into the rice field they go.

  7. #7
    Meg
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    Oyagoi Meg's Avatar
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    I think Cindy was trying to tell you that the problem is a mud pond is emptied and treated/worked some how and then dried out and then refilled on a regular or seasonal basis, some kind of rotation I think(???)
    anyway, there is no way to do that kind of work on an lined pond with a foot mud or clay in the bottom of it and therefore it would be difficult or impossible to keep you version of a mud pond healthy in the long run.

    as Ric suggest an expert with some pointers could help you

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