Home | About Us | Contact Us


Koi Forum - Koi-Bito Magazine straight from Japan
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 21

Thread: Adhering Rock to EPDM

  1. #1
    Tategoi Peppy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    497

    Adhering Rock to EPDM

    The sides of my pond are raise about 6 inches with EPDM over block.

    I found stepping stones at Home Depot for atop the raised edge. They sit there nicely and overhang maybe an inch on each side and look great.

    My cat loves to drink fish water (as opposed to the water in her dish) and who knows what other animals visit. I saw our resident groundhog wandering around a couple times though I don't know if it drinks from the pond.

    I'm afraid an animal teetering on the edge of one of these stepping stones might unbalance the stone, sending both stone and animal for a dip.

    So anyway, I was wondering if anyone had any experience using either:
    • black waterfall foam
    • black silicone sealant for ponds
    to adhere stone to EPDM?
    ...enjoy your day!
    5500 gllns, Ultima II 4000, Tarpon 6000, 1 Multi-Cyclone Prefilter, 2 - 5500 gph pumps, 1 Retro BD, 1 skimmer, max depth 4', 5% trickle 24/7 weather permitting

  2. #2
    Sansai MysticKoi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    237
    The foam material will stick the rock to rubber liner, but it isn't very strong. I wold fear that the stone would break loose, and in goes your guest!

    One idea that works well is to purchase some Wonder Board (the stuff used to back ceramic tiles) and some concrete screws. Trim the board to fit the block, place it on top of the liner, then screw it through into the block. You now have a sturdy base from which you can mortor the stones to the board. When mortoring the stones in place, butter the exposed edges of the Wonder Board for a nice look.

    Bill

  3. #3
    Jumbo bighatbulls's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Reedley, California
    Posts
    907
    Are those the plastic stones, the ones made out of recycled rubber? Or are they they the stone, stones? Not the Rolling Stones, I doubt Mick would make a nice pond feature, no matter how interesting that might be to see. They aren't made of cement are they? How wide are these stones, and about how heavy are they? What do you mean they sit on the edge and overhang about an inch on both sides? How did you do the edging of the pond? Mine is a mishmash of old recycled cement walk. Old as in 50+yrs. When I did my edging I actually did it twice because the way we did it first allowed debris to get in the pond. The way I suggest doing edging comes from the Miracle Grow water garden book.

    A good way to prevent the liner from showing: Dig the edging shelf deep enough for a double layer of edging (brick, flagstone, cut stone, etc.), then wrap the liner over the first layer and top with a second layer of edging. Water can now be filled to the middle of the first layer of edging. With one layer of edging, the water can be filled to only a little below the bottom of the edging material.

    The picture I posted sorta shows how I did the edging. I then added some lovely small river rock and plants. I hope this was helpful. I don't have cats falling in my pond but those blocks aren't going anywhere.
    Amanda Bulls-Stephens
    Creator of "The Tail End"
    Central California Koi Society

  4. #4
    Jumbo bighatbulls's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Reedley, California
    Posts
    907
    well shoot, it didn't take the upload sorry.

  5. #5
    Oyagoi CarolinaGirl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    1,620
    The suggestion that Amanda made is a very attractive solution, but creates a different problem. That is how I did my pond. The block walls come up to about 8" below the water level, creating a shelf for rocks to sit on. It looks great! But now, 6 years later, the space between and behind the rocks is full of the foulest, thickest goop you can imagine. All sorts of stuff has gotten hung up there to rot and there is no way to get it out. I'll be re-doing my pond this fall (hopefully) to eliminate that problem. If the rocks were mortared in then it might be OK.

    As far as sticking the rocks to the top edge....I think great stuff would work pretty well. I know it sticks to both rocks and liner very well! If a person were to lean on that edge the rock might come loose, but a cat would not dislodge it.

  6. #6
    Tategoi Peppy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    497
    CG, I was thinking the same thing about any type of rock below the water line. I place a couple bricks in my skimmer last year and when I moved them, they were black underneath and smelled horrible.

    Bighat, I took a picture with my cell phone but now I have to try and figure out how to email the picture to myself so I can save it and post it. My email address has an underscore in it and I've never texted so don't know where to find that. I'm the butt of many jokes because I program the pc in Visual Basic all the time, have it talk to me and verbally check my work, etc., am adept at QODBC and Access but can't do a darn thing with the cell phone. That's because my brain is full of PC stuff and if I put any more technology in there it will explode! Seriously, though, I'm so sick of the PC, I don't have any patience left for any other technology.

  7. #7
    Tategoi Peppy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    497
    I'm going out to mow and will do the photo later. See?!! I already lost my patience!

  8. #8
    Jumbo bighatbulls's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Reedley, California
    Posts
    907
    Quote Originally Posted by CarolinaGirl View Post
    The suggestion that Amanda made is a very attractive solution, but creates a different problem. That is how I did my pond. The block walls come up to about 8" below the water level, creating a shelf for rocks to sit on. It looks great! But now, 6 years later, the space between and behind the rocks is full of the foulest, thickest goop you can imagine. All sorts of stuff has gotten hung up there to rot and there is no way to get it out. I'll be re-doing my pond this fall (hopefully) to eliminate that problem. If the rocks were mortared in then it might be OK.

    As far as sticking the rocks to the top edge....I think great stuff would work pretty well. I know it sticks to both rocks and liner very well! If a person were to lean on that edge the rock might come loose, but a cat would not dislodge it.
    CG I haven't had that problem (yet), but maybe it depends on what you have behind the edging? I need to take pictures of my fines filter, so I will also take pictures of the pond edging.

  9. #9
    Oyagoi CarolinaGirl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    1,620
    Filtration doesn't matter. The stuff that's behind the rocks is stuff that never had a chance to get to the filters, such as koi food that gets splashed in between the rocks during the feeding frenzy. My liner is behind the rocks, with dirt against the back of the liner. There are small spaces between the rocks and under them in some places and this is the area where stuff gets trapped.

    These rocks weight 200 to 300 pounds, so moving them to clean around them is impossible. Besides....the submerged rocks are perfect for scaring a potential show fish when she goes rooting around for the food that's floated in there. I'd much rather see an inch or two of liner than see a scar on the head of an otherwise perfect fish

  10. #10
    Jumbo bighatbulls's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Reedley, California
    Posts
    907
    Quote Originally Posted by CarolinaGirl View Post
    Filtration doesn't matter. The stuff that's behind the rocks is stuff that never had a chance to get to the filters, such as koi food that gets splashed in between the rocks during the feeding frenzy. My liner is behind the rocks, with dirt against the back of the liner. There are small spaces between the rocks and under them in some places and this is the area where stuff gets trapped.

    These rocks weight 200 to 300 pounds, so moving them to clean around them is impossible. Besides....the submerged rocks are perfect for scaring a potential show fish when she goes rooting around for the food that's floated in there. I'd much rather see an inch or two of liner than see a scar on the head of an otherwise perfect fish
    I think I might have confused you. The filtration is for a different thread about a fines filter I made on the cheap . My stones, as the picture shows are much smaller. I have not had a problem with scars, but I understand your worry there. At the moment I only have goldfish and mosquito fish in this pond.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Adhering Rock to EPDM-sdc11655.jpg  

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Rock
    By 300wby in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 05-11-2012, 05:26 PM
  2. Another rock bottom ?
    By N2koi in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 08-04-2009, 09:21 PM
  3. to rock or not?
    By happykoilady in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 27
    Last Post: 06-27-2008, 11:04 AM
  4. Rock Garden
    By RayJordan in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 04-29-2008, 08:51 PM
  5. where to get rock?
    By iceman27030 in forum Pond Construction
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 08-16-2007, 10:24 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Articles - Sitemap - FAQs and Rules

KB Footer Graphic
Straight from Japan... For the serious hobbyist!
All content and images copyright of: Koi-bito.com