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Thread: Would Like Design Help!

  1. #11
    Honmei ricshaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by schildkoi View Post
    BINGO! (at least at the water volume I am guessing that the pump will use).

    The effectiveness of a vortex is dependent on two factors, the dwell time and the reduction in current velocity (diameter is key here). If the resulting velocity reduction is minimal and the velocity is such that there is not enough dwell time, very liitle separation will occur. The larger, less heavy items (such as leaves) will smply pass right through and clog the pump's leaf basket anyway. But, let's wait for the specifics before we jump to that conclusion.
    I wasn't even thinking "vortex", I thought we were talking about a sock or filter mat.

  2. #12
    Sansai
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    Quote Originally Posted by schildkoi View Post
    Ric and Cindy, the question really is whether any of the options you present supply an adequate amount of water for the barrel's tolerance and even if so, there is yet another issue not yet considered.

    If I can get that pump model number (that matches up to one of the performance curves) and the piping info, we can solve the initial issues and then evaluate the other issue I allude to.

    I'd also like to get the barrel's diameter and height measurements.
    Steve, here is a link to the performance curve for this pump, it is the 1/2-75 low rpm pump in the top group. The barrel is 36" high and 22" in diameter. I will upload some pictures of the current setup as soon as I get them downloaded to my computer. At present between the skimmers and the barrel, I am not getting any debris in the pump's leaf basket. My goal in this is to get the maximum possible flow from my skimmers to my shower. The pipe runs: 4" out of skimmer-88'w/equivalent of 4-90's; 3" out of skimmer 70' - 2 90's and a 45. To shower- 45' from pump some combination of 2"(short length)transitioning to 4". 7' up to top of shower, 2-90's then tee to spray bar.
    Quote Originally Posted by ricshaw View Post
    I agree, you need to know the pump's demands.

    I am having a little problem with a 8800 gallon pond dumping into a 70 gallon barrel feeding a 1/2 HP pump (if that is what it is).
    How effective is the 70 gallon barrel's mechanical filtration?
    This circuit is only my skimmer circuit. I have two aerated bottom drains to two Cetus sieves to two moving beds each w/their own 1/4 hp artesian pump( don't know model numbers as that filtration has been ok for my pond-I am working on better koi; looking for more growth and have halved the number of koi since the beginning of the summer. Ammonia always 0, nitrates 0, nitrates vary depending on last water change and feeding from 5-15). So far the 70 gallon barrel w/ the springflo has worked ok for what I want it to do.
    The area where the barrel sits is in quite tight quarters, so I figured that the single six inch line running inside the filter house would be easier to deal with the 2 lines and wye outside.

  3. #13
    Sansai
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    Here are some of the pics. The plan is to bury the shower outflow pipes and level up the ground in that area. Also will add the tee for foam extraction.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Would Like Design Help!-img_6614.jpg   Would Like Design Help!-img_6618.jpg   Would Like Design Help!-img_6617.jpg   Would Like Design Help!-img_6613.jpg   Would Like Design Help!-img_6619.jpg  


  4. #14
    Sansai
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    The high light blue barrel goes to a 1000 gallon plant and goldfish pond.
    Also the top of the darker blue barrel is at or slightly above the pond water level and the midpoint of the spraybar is 7.5' above the pond.

  5. #15
    Sansai
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    3 of my koi
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Would Like Design Help!-img_6353.jpg  

  6. #16
    Honmei
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaL View Post
    Steve, here is a link to the performance curve for this pump, it is the 1/2-75 low rpm pump in the top group. The barrel is 36" high and 22" in diameter. I will upload some pictures of the current setup as soon as I get them downloaded to my computer. At present between the skimmers and the barrel, I am not getting any debris in the pump's leaf basket. My goal in this is to get the maximum possible flow from my skimmers to my shower. The pipe runs: 4' out of skimmer-88'w/equivalent of 4-90's; 3" out of skimmer 70'. To shower- 45' from pump some combination of 2"(short length)transitioning to 4". 7' up to top of shower, 2-90's then tee to spray bar.

    This circuit is only my skimmer circuit. I have two aerated bottom drains to two Cetus sieves to two moving beds each w/their own 1/4 hp artesian pump( don't know model numbers as that filtration has been ok for my pond-I am working on better koi; looking for more growth and have halved the number of koi since the beginning of the summer. Ammonia always 0, nitrates 0, nitrates vary depending on last water change and feeding from 5-15). So far the 70 gallon barrel w/ the springflo has worked ok for what I want it to do.
    The area where the barrel sits is in quite tight quarters, so I figured that the single six inch line running inside the filter house would be easier to deal with the 2 lines and wye outside.
    Feed me a bone please Goria....the link or the model number will suffice. I think you forgot both above.

    I just need the piping components for the discharge side of the pump. size and lenth of each section of pipe and the types of fittings, the numbers of each...and size of each. If I am reading right the top of the shower is 7' above the water level of the pond?
    The views presented are my personal views and not that of any organization that I may belong to unless otherwise specified. [email protected]
    CKHPA

  7. #17
    Honmei ricshaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by schildkoi View Post
    Feed me a bone please Goria....the link or the model number will suffice. I think you forgot both above.

    I just need the piping components for the discharge side of the pump. size and lenth of each section of pipe and the types of fittings, the numbers of each...and size of each. If I am reading right the top of the shower is 7' above the water level of the pond?
    Steve,

    It is most likely the Performance Pro Artesian Pump Low RPM A1/2-75 - 7860 GPH.

    Here is the pump curve:
    http://www.performancepropumps.com/P...tesian1725.pdf

  8. #18
    Oyagoi
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    just some side notes but will let Steve keep you going

    i do not think she is getting any vortex in barrel but has it full of springflo.feel being skimmer feeding into barrel really will not get any settling anyway. using it more(guessing) to trap leaves and pine needles in the strapping so she does not have to take about the lid on priming pot(they are a bee itch to do) so good thinking there.

    also just a note for steve and also question to Gloria.
    picture 3 has the the valve all the way open
    picture 4 has valve partial shut
    first problem valve is BEFORE the pump and not after where is should be for throttling back
    BUT anyway asking why it is open and partial shut in picture could this be where the pump is getting starved also of water.

    OK
    your in good hands but just a few side notes
    Paul Korf

    member of:
    Midwest Pond and Koi Society
    Louisville Koi club
    IKONA

  9. #19
    Sansai
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    Sorry, here is the link:
    http://www.performancepropumps.com/artesian_curves.htm
    The outflow will be 2" out of pump, 90*sweep(2") 2:4 inch connector 44feet 4" pipe-90* elbow-6.5feet 4" -90* elbow to 4" tee spraybar. Of course some of these will vary by a foot or two depending on how we can get the pipes to run out of the filter house,barrel/pump positioning ,etc.
    Yes shower is 7' above pond- the shower enters the pond via a 15' stream that slopes up 12-18" above the pond.

  10. #20
    Sansai
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    Quote Originally Posted by pskorf View Post
    just some side notes but will let Steve keep you going

    i do not think she is getting any vortex in barrel but has it full of springflo.feel being skimmer feeding into barrel really will not get any settling anyway. using it more(guessing) to trap leaves and pine needles in the strapping so she does not have to take about the lid on priming pot(they are a bee itch to do) so good thinking there.

    also just a note for steve and also question to Gloria.
    picture 3 has the the valve all the way open
    picture 4 has valve partial shut
    first problem valve is BEFORE the pump and not after where is should be for throttling back
    BUT anyway asking why it is open and partial shut in picture could this be where the pump is getting starved also of water.

    OK
    your in good hands but just a few side notes
    Paul your explanation is right on. As to the valves the guy who helps me with the plumbing and pond had somebody here with him today. After I took the pictures I went back in the filter house to check everything. Things were not right!! One filter was turned off and the valve from the bottom drain shut. And that valve was partly closed as you noted. On the pump, if allowed to run with the valves wide open it will suck air. However I crank down the valve on the outflow line just enough to keep water in the barrel, not the inflow line. That inflow valve was returned to wide open shortly after the pic was taken. Sharp eyes!

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