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Thread: Bakki Shower vs Matala Biosteps 10

  1. #1
    Fry
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    Bakki Shower vs Matala Biosteps 10

    Hi,

    Im in the stage of planning my 2nd pond. 1st was 200 gallons which proved to be small for my kois which is why now im planning to make a bigger home for them.

    2nd pond will be approx 1400 gals depending on which filtration system i would use, my initial plan is to utilize 2x RioHF17 for the pumps and 1x vortex which is 1.5ft in dia. now the question is to use 2x Biosteps 10 for my filter or use a 4-layer bakki shower (Fiberfill foams, japanese mats, bioballs and bio ceramic rings for the medias) upon canvassing I came up with 14,000Php for 2 Biosteps. From my point of view these filters will be easier to maintain since towers will be high and i will need a ladder to constantly remove wastes from the layers. which is why I am confused, it may actually be cheaper to have a tower fabricated. thanks in advance

  2. #2
    Daihonmei PapaBear's Avatar
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    Step back from the plans you've been considering and read a few more pond and filtration threads first. You are aimed in a "better" direction, but neither of these choices will take you where you want to be without some refinements and a better understanding of how things work "best" for you and your Koi.

  3. #3
    Fry
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaBear View Post
    Step back from the plans you've been considering and read a few more pond and filtration threads first. You are aimed in a "better" direction, but neither of these choices will take you where you want to be without some refinements and a better understanding of how things work "best" for you and your Koi.
    Yes bro. Ive done that which is why I revised my plan. Will use 1 settlement chamber, then onto mech filtration chamber containing brushes then to the pump chamber. Utilizing 2 submersible filters with 1 prefilter for each. These pumps will then feed the 2x biosteps 10 filter with gravity return to the pond.

    Pond dimensions: 10x6 ft with a depth of 3 on the sides and 4 in the drain which is placed in the middle of the pond and the volume is estimated at 1500gals. Will utilize a concrete bd feeding a 3" pipe.

    The 3 chambers i mentioned will be 18"x20" and a depth of 3ft.

    Any suggestions are welcome before i go on and dig my pond.

  4. #4
    Daihonmei PapaBear's Avatar
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    I'm glad you've decided to go with a Bottom Drain and good settlement and mechanical in front of your bio. There are a lot of units out there that try to use matala or j-mat for mechanical filtration, and they quickly become a hassle to maintain as the heterotrophs just can't keep up with that many solids. Chambers and Bakki's both need water that is already clean (mechanically) to give you good performance without a lot of extra work to keep them from becoming plugged up with debris.

    Sizing everything properly is the most important thing at this stage. I don't know about using the prefilters on the pump suction lines though. What type pumps are you planning to use and where/how will they be plumbed in to the mechanical filter chambers? You want to get the most bang for the buck, and selecting the right pump for your application can save or break your pocketbook both at time of purchase and daily operating expense.
    Larry Iles
    Oklahoma

  5. #5
    Fry
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaBear View Post
    I'm glad you've decided to go with a Bottom Drain and good settlement and mechanical in front of your bio. There are a lot of units out there that try to use matala or j-mat for mechanical filtration, and they quickly become a hassle to maintain as the heterotrophs just can't keep up with that many solids. Chambers and Bakki's both need water that is already clean (mechanically) to give you good performance without a lot of extra work to keep them from becoming plugged up with debris.

    Sizing everything properly is the most important thing at this stage. I don't know about using the prefilters on the pump suction lines though. What type pumps are you planning to use and where/how will they be plumbed in to the mechanical filter chambers? You want to get the most bang for the buck, and selecting the right pump for your application can save or break your pocketbook both at time of purchase and daily operating expense.
    The plan is to feed the settlement from the bd then a pipe will transfer the water to the mech brush chamber. Afterwhich it will go to the pump chamber with prefilters. Will utilize 3x2" pvc pipes for settlement to mech to pump. Prefilters will have fiberfoams tehn onto the pump. Will use 2x rio hyperflow17 pumps which will pump approx 900gals at 4ft head. Since i will utilize a prefilter, i can simply raise the pumps if the head is too high to achieve desired flow rate. Assuming at the lowest i achieve 700gph x2 pumps. It will still be enough to turn the 1500 once per hour. To increase the circulation. Will use resun aco001 air compressor to power 200mm air disk on top of the drain, it has around 25 to 30 l/min capacity. What do you think bro? Hehe

    Cheers!

  6. #6
    Daihonmei PapaBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carldelmundo View Post
    The plan is to feed the settlement from the bd then a pipe will transfer the water to the mech brush chamber. Afterwhich it will go to the pump chamber with prefilters. Will utilize 3x2" pvc pipes for settlement to mech to pump. Prefilters will have fiberfoams tehn onto the pump. Will use 2x rio hyperflow17 pumps which will pump approx 900gals at 4ft head. Since i will utilize a prefilter, i can simply raise the pumps if the head is too high to achieve desired flow rate. Assuming at the lowest i achieve 700gph x2 pumps. It will still be enough to turn the 1500 once per hour. To increase the circulation. Will use resun aco001 air compressor to power 200mm air disk on top of the drain, it has around 25 to 30 l/min capacity. What do you think bro? Hehe

    Cheers!
    A line drawing of the plumbing from chamber to chamber might be useful from this point forward, including your drain lines from settlement and pump chambers.
    As to the pump head...it doesn't work the way you describe. Head isn't determined by how high or low in the chamber the pump is placed. Head is determined by the level of the water in the pump chamber compared to the level of the chamber you are pumping to plus whatever additional resistance you may have in the pump plumbing. Raising or lowering the pump itself doesn't have any impact on it whatsoever.

  7. #7
    Fry
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaBear View Post
    A line drawing of the plumbing from chamber to chamber might be useful from this point forward, including your drain lines from settlement and pump chambers.
    As to the pump head...it doesn't work the way you describe. Head isn't determined by how high or low in the chamber the pump is placed. Head is determined by the level of the water in the pump chamber compared to the level of the chamber you are pumping to plus whatever additional resistance you may have in the pump plumbing. Raising or lowering the pump itself doesn't have any impact on it whatsoever.
    First of all, let me thank you for taking the time to educate me for this project. As for the line connection, these chambers will be positioned side by side so just a pipe connecting them together, from the drain to the bottom of the settlement chamber then 1' from the bottom of this settlement chamber are the 2" pipes going to the mech brush chamber then another set of 2" pipes to go to the chamber all these chambers are almost square in shape so the inlet to the chamber is to the right and then the pipes going to the next chamber is located on the left most part of the chamber to make sure they pass thru the brushes. My pumps are submersible and will be feeded by a hose from the prefilter so i could place them above water if ever the pump ceases to achieve the desired flow rate. The inlet of the main filter is on the upper most part and it stands 2' tall so pretty much the height from the water level is around 2.5' to 3'. hmmm, anything else i should look out for? By the way, will you suggest taht i put a surface skimmer for this size of a pond? Kinda budgeting the cost as well hehe. Cheers mate!

  8. #8
    Daihonmei PapaBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carldelmundo View Post
    First of all, let me thank you for taking the time to educate me for this project. As for the line connection, these chambers will be positioned side by side so just a pipe connecting them together, from the drain to the bottom of the settlement chamber then 1' from the bottom of this settlement chamber are the 2" pipes going to the mech brush chamber then another set of 2" pipes to go to the chamber all these chambers are almost square in shape so the inlet to the chamber is to the right and then the pipes going to the next chamber is located on the left most part of the chamber to make sure they pass thru the brushes. My pumps are submersible and will be feeded by a hose from the prefilter so i could place them above water if ever the pump ceases to achieve the desired flow rate. The inlet of the main filter is on the upper most part and it stands 2' tall so pretty much the height from the water level is around 2.5' to 3'. hmmm, anything else i should look out for? By the way, will you suggest taht i put a surface skimmer for this size of a pond? Kinda budgeting the cost as well hehe. Cheers mate!
    You'll thank yourself for installing a skimmer circuit. You can get one for a pond this size at a pretty low cost, and it will save you a lot of work (and frustration) over the long haul.

    Moving the water from the pond to each chamber the right way is important. From the bottom drain you need to feed the settlement chamber from well above the bottom of the SC, otherwise you'll wind up stirring the detritus continually rather than settling it out. If you look at any of the commercial Settlement units sold you'll see what I mean.

    Feeding your pumps through a hose/prefilter is generally a bad idea. It wastes energy sucking through a restriction which leaves you pumping less water for every dollar you spend on electricity. Those setups are usually only used by people who don't have a bottom drain and have their pump/prefilter in the bottom of the pond, which isn't a very efficient way to get the job done.

  9. #9
    Fry
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    I see. Good thing i did the planning as i havent purchased the prefilters yet. Yup as for the SC, the feed will come from 1ft from the bottom and another ft for the outlet which will then feed the mechanical chamber. Ayt so now ill go find a skimmer hehe. Thanks a lot bro

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