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Thread: Mud pond

  1. #1
    Oyagoi koifishgirl's Avatar
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    Smile Mud pond

    Is their a time limit that I should wait after filling my pond with water that I should wait before I put my koi in the pond? Should I let the pond settle a while first?

  2. #2
    Oyagoi koifishgirl's Avatar
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    Smile

    I dont believe this, as you guys are to smart not to answer this one.

  3. #3
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
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    Is it the pond for permanent residence of adult koi, the pond for spawning, or the pond for raising fry hatched elsewhere?

  4. #4
    Tategoi ranskye's Avatar
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    sorry kfg never saw this post, ill assume its for fry, that way if i kill all your fry atleast i havent killed your breeders.
    mike might be a lot braver than me.
    ill let him advise when you can let your big ones go for a good swim.
    what i would say is its hard to know or guess with a brand new pond, though do check your water first.

    i dont know what everyone else does but if im spawning in the pond, ill fill it up and let it settle for around 3 days for my iron to oxidize out, my waters red to begin with from the bore. you want to let the pond settle and oxygenate.
    ill put my koi breeders in after that, say on afternoon 3 after filling, theyll spawn that first night and sometimes i leave em a second night if theyve not done real good with plenty of eggs around.
    i remove eggs and replace spawning material. you could probably place eggs directly in pond after spawning/removal if your using the same water to breed thats in your pond. check temp.

    they hatch about 4-5 days later (temp dependant) at which time there hopefully is an algae bloom beggining, by the time they are about to eat say around the second day after hatch, there should be rotifers (live feed for them) for first feeding.
    if you leave your pond too long there will be organisms around that will eat your tiny koi and most likely less rotifers and things too big to fit in a first feedings kois mouth that will likely prey on rotifers, as the days progress and my fry get bigger, my pond will get bigger zoo planktons in it, that now they can eat as they get a bigger mouth. its inportant to have this timing pretty good for a bumper quick growing batch. but if you stick close to it i thing youll do ok first time round.
    it changes from pond to pond (temps and sunlight and whatever affects a bloom) so the susequent zooplankton availablity is affected by these things too.
    you should watch the pond for the signs of early life, second time round you can get have a better idea when to stock.
    main thing is to try coincide first feed with the availabklity of the first presence of small zooplanktons.
    first time round id say dont let it go any more than 5 days before spawning in it, never ten days unless its cold and you shouldnt be spawning anyway. dont want to panic you but a brand new pond might have its own intricacies. for me and if it were my only pond, id stock it with eggs 4-5 days after filling or stock it with free swimming larve hatched larvae about 10-13 days after filling.
    you may have that clay thing worrying you.. either tyr some gypsum or better for your first time, pretend its not there, just lime it, and give it ago anyway but you might like to not put your breeders directly in a brand spanking new pond. i assume your water is ok after settling.
    i spose youll have to go off someones plan and adjust it to suit you as you get experience with your situation.
    if you spawn in tanks or somewhere other than the pond, still breed in time line with this so you can put eggs in or release hatched fry in time for the first feed of rotifers, one thing though if you want to stock in hatched larvae is to watch ph is not too high, ussually stock in the morning and never over 9. also temper your fry with pond water before release.

  5. #5
    Oyagoi koifishgirl's Avatar
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    Thanks Guy,

    Mike I want to put my female in my larger pond. It scares the hell out of me as I am affaired that I might lose the koi. About 4 years ago my boyfriends mother had a pond built and after the pond was full she purchased a bunch of fingerlings and put in the pond and all died. I dont know if mud ponds go through a ammonia spike as new liner pond do or not and wanted to be safe before putting her into the pond.

    I still have not had the pond built because of the weather here, it wont stop raining long enough to get the ponds dug. The builder is just waiting for the weather to get right. If the weather does not improve I am going to have to keep my koi sperated for longer than I wanted. I dont know if this has a braring on them spawninng or not.

    I dont think that I am going to use the kiddie pool to spawn my koi as I am scared that I will kill the eggs. If I need to build a spawning tank say you think 300 gallons would be what I need. I want to be safe instead of sorry. I can buy some EPDM liner to build this with. What size do you suggest?

  6. #6
    Daihonmei MikeM's Avatar
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    KFG: You are getting into subjects about which I know something, but perhaps just enough to be dangerous?The posters with real breeding experience may have more useful advice.

    Soils go through many changes when they become submerged. A brand new mud pond may need "conditioning" by just filling with water and allowing it to lay fallow for a while. The more humic material in the soil, the more the chance of "rotting", with hydrogen sulfide and the like forming in the substrate. Over time, natural processes take hold and a sort of equilibrium occurs. Different bacteria etc will take up residence than is true in non-submerged soils.

    If you were using the pond for fry, then you would want to fertilize (chicken guano?) to encourage an algae bloom and production of living foods. Fry are fragile in some respects, but the huge volume of a mud pond provides a huge cushion. For adult fish, I'd want the pond to age for some time. The presence of dragonfly nymphs and the like is not the concern it is with a fry pond, so letting time pass is not a concern. If your soils have a moderately high iron content, as I suspect they may, you will have some protection against hydrogen sulfide forming in the substrate. But, other substances may go into solution and take some time to become bound up in organic molecules. So, subject to different advice from one having hands-on experience with koi mud ponds, I'd suggest you fill your pond and just let it sit a month or two before introducing adult fish. That will give you an opportunity to test water parameters after it stabilizes and decide if the parameters are what you want. Make sense?

  7. #7
    Tategoi ranskye's Avatar
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    yep two months makes sense. its enough time for things to be "used" up in a cycle.
    theres a lesson to learn from your mans mothers mistake. one trick you can use is to throw in some trash fish for a number of days as guinea pigs to check your water.
    not everything needs to worry you if you use some knowledge to make you feel comfortable. it becomes simple when you do that.
    i find when i do something ive done near to before, i think well these fish will be ok because i know this works. sometimes you take a risk and keep an eye out and if it works you add it to your experience for next time.

    if pairs are kept together, naturally sometime or another they will be triggered to spawn and its very dissapointing when that happens when you dont have everything ready and timed for them. i need to breed over the whole breeding period maybe 5 months to have constant fish coming out at small sizes ove rthe year. it works for me for this long, for you it may only be neccessary to breed them early in the season once and then you can hold them together if space is not available for seperation. many people breed like that successfully in the backyard. if you have the space then keeping them apart for extended period does not affect them unless you leave it too late to spawn ( as the temps and daylength decreases). i dont know the temps over there but id go out on a limb to say that you could hold them apart for up to four months after the locals begin breeding that season.

    might be worth me mentioning also.
    hows your p[ond gonna be constructed? have you thought about tapers and a harvest trench or can you make one on the outside of the pond maybe?
    ive seen too many ponds in my life that dont drain right and leave puddles of dying fish. have a think about it to make things easier.

  8. #8
    Oyagoi koifishgirl's Avatar
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    Slopeing side and thought about shallow end being 3 ft. deep dropping to 4ft deep so I can drain ponds and fish be in deap end of pond for harvest and culling. This is just what I think will help me in culling since I will have to do this by myself. Since I will have three small ponds like this I think I can keep one pond at a time in good shape to move the fry after culling.

    Thanks for the replies and I think you may be right about the mud pond establishing. Makes sense

    Thinking about a liner for my big pond but I want to know what the pro,s and con,s are for this. If the pond is large enough will they grow as good as they would in a mud pond? Or a least close. I want to leave them in the mud pond for the first year and then move them to a lined pond for viewing reasons, and concern of water supply in dry months.

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