swim bladder

[vimes]

hi all
are there differant degrees of swim bladder problems
i have a large kohaku (new addition) who will sit on the bottom with fins out right up to food time then up she comes as hungry as all the others barging in to get the food after all the food has gone its back to sitting on the bottom
the reason i ask about swimbladder is she seems to swim more awarkwardly then the others (seems to move her body to and fro more rarther than glide)and when taking food she seems to almost sink then pushers her self back up
if it is a swim bladder prob what can be done
regards
lee

[Akinosan]

Hey Lee,
I had the same problem with one of my Koi not too long ago, and it is definitly a swim bladder problem. The worst thing about it is that by sitting on the bottom all the time they are more succeptible to bad bacteria and disease. I don't believe there is anything you can do about it that will cure the problem. Sorry.

[callum]

I have a sanke which does the same thing, sits on the bottom and swims on her side a bit.

[koifishgirl]

He is right there is not cure. Its a shame to lose koi to this, sorry to hear about your koi's

[shaw]

Someone I know has a large (and magnificent I might add) sanke with what is most probably a swim bladder problem.

The koi was moved to a shallower pond which puts less pressure on the swim bladder and has been fed medicated food (no idea what it is) and the pond water salted to 0.3%. She is reportedly improving (note this have been over a few months), swimming a bit more frequently an putting back a bit of girth. Note she has not fully recovered but seems to be on the mend, albeit very slowly. Not sure if she will ever fully recover.

Hope this helps.

[sharpey999]

Sorry for bringing up an old thread but I think I need some advice


Firstly my fish are impossible to catch with a net so cant treat them individually
Secondly they are so small that injections etc.. would probably be too much.

I have a small ghost that is about 7" and was very boysterous until the last week or so. It is now fighting to stay in equilibrium and when stops swimming its head starts to rise towards the surface.

I have read this could be swim bladder and a possible solution would be a laxative (frozen pea) to reduce pressure and hopefully rectify

Does anone have any ideas or solutions seiing as I cannot capture the fish to chek it over or make sure that he eats?

Thanks

Craig

[Kohaku]

I have heard that duckweed makes a good laxative and can help with swim bladder irregularities.

[adreamer2]

I have heard that you must starve your fish first for a good two days... Isolate the creature then give steamed peas.....



Adreamer2

[marco]

Swim bladder afflictions can have differents origins
- Pressure on the swim bladder due to tumor, constipation, obstruction of the little communication between swim bladder and gut, infection by Myxobolus, and sudden changement of water temperature, and then some trauma (spawning, koï jumping out of the pond ..).

There is some little things to help the fish:
- raise the temperature up so the immunity will be stronger agains infections
- add some salt to help the osmoregulation
- also use injection of antibiotics to prevent infection
- laxative could help too, a little parafine on the food will help too

If the fish die, it will be better to make an autopsy and look for a myxobollus infection that could pass to other koï, in that case it's suatable to treat the pond with furazolidone or ecetarsol, but the infection is difficult to treat. If you have only one koï with that problem, forget the myxobollus infection

It is also possible tu suck the liquid inside the swim bladder with a punction made under echography and then inject cortisone and antibiotics in the swim bladder, buit it's noit easy to find people who can do it and the koï must have a reasonnable size to do it.

Good luck

[Brutuscz]

I am glad this subject is up on the boards again. I have had problems recently with ulcers, mouth rot and fin rot. I am working to fix these problems and have injected about 25 koi with nuflor. Nuflor is oil based ad very thick...used a 20guage needle via the IP route..behind the ventral fin..with the koi being held upside down. Two koi are now having these swim bladder problems. One is a 9 inch asagi..lays on the bottom properly..goes to swim and its really erratic..almost spastic looking. The other is a 6inch doitsu sanke(in my avatar)..he is swimming and eating well...but just looks very awkward..curving his body funny while swimming..not graceful like before the shot. Anyone else see this after an injection, and will it go back to normal as the oil based medication dissipates into the body of the fish? Any advice??

[marco]

Nuflor has been used in really large quantity for now 10 years on calves and cows, we stop to use it because it was too irritant for muscle. We now have some better products, stronger with no side effect (Draxxin from Pfizer could be one of them, but I'm still waiting some information from Pfizer)
So the irritation could be an explanation of your problem.
When you inject it (whatever way you use to inject, IM, IP or under the skin), nuflor reach a hight concentration in the gut, so you can have some digestive problems due to the fact that nuflor also kill the benefic bacteria of digestion.
That could also explain the problem you have.
But this is only theory ....

PS: If there are some English teachers, sorry for the mistakes I often do.


Marco

[Brutuscz]

Thanks Marco. I chose nuflor because 1: I could get it!!! 2: It is mostly a one shot deal..since I was treating many fish it was easier.

The problem I have, happened way too quickly to be a bacterial gut flora type of thing....it was almost immediate. Could I have damaged the swim bladder when I flipped the fish over...or the bolus of the injection put pressure on something? Its two really nice koi...dont want to lose them. Bad thing is, they only had minor problems compared to some others...a small amount of fin rot or a small ulcer. I gave them the shot to prevent it from progressing. Now, they may die...really upsetting.