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Close, but still a way to go

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  • Close, but still a way to go

    to loose that 'low class breeder' title I've given myself!

    I spent last evening reducing the numbers of the first kohaku spawn; I'm down to 300 now.

    The photo below shows a bowl of 'nearlies'.
    Top left is the second biggest at 16cm, but sadly a little bald.
    Next to it is a maruten with lovely skin, but the pattern is bland.
    Center bottom is going to end shiro muji.
    The one with best potential of this bunch is center right, the pattern look insignificant at this stage, but will look good when bigger, shame the tail stop is a little large.

    Still 'low class'
  • #2

    Cmon Maurice. I think you're doing a fine job.
    Your dream batch will come, in time.
    What bloodline are the brood fish ?


    • #3

      Doug, the female used in this pairing is from the Momotaro 'Eagle' line.
      I also have a huge Kohaku spawning from a sister of 'Seio’ (runner up at the last All Japan and in with a chance of winning in the future, if it had not passed away). These guys are only a few weeks old, but I’m excited with the expectations!!

      I’m running very late with the spawning, as it has taken much longer than expected to get the new mud ponds finished.

      I have also Hariwake at around 4”, chagoi a couple of weeks old, heading for an inch. Day after tomorrow will be Kujaku and end of the week, or next week will be another sanke and a showa.
      I shall still spawn into August, as I need to check the quality of a few sets.


      • #4

        Effort reflected,...

        Hi Maurice, your very hard work and determination is showing results! Hang in & stay healthy - don't forget to sleep and eat occasionally!

        Best Wishes,


        • #5

          I'll take that maruten off your hands! I like the simple elegance of the pattern. I think it is a shame that a more complex pattern tends to be picked by show judges...


          • #6

            C'mon Jason, you knew some judge would pick on you for that :roll:

            Maurice, your koi look very promising. Keep at it, I think you are on the right track too. Last year's Rocky Mountain Koi Club GC was a Hiroshima Sakai two step kohaku that by some definitions, might be called "bland". It won easy. So don't give up on us judges... :shock:
            Best regards,

            Bob Winkler

            My opinions are my best interpretation of my experiences. They are not set in stone as I intend to always be a student of life. And Koi.



            • #7

              Did i see "kujaku" mentioned in the spawning process??????? lets see the parents Maurice I am very interested in the type of Kujaku you are going to produce.

              Best Regards,
              Alex Gibbs


              • #8

                Caught me, Bob! :lol:

                But seriously I suspect an inazuma of the same quality would've been picked over the simply elegant two step. The more complex pattern tends to win. BUT how often does the pattern determine the winner (assuming no clear demerits, of course) -- I'd say very very rarely.



                • #9

                  You are right.. Pattern very rarely determines the winner. Glad we could have this chat. :P
                  Best regards,

                  Bob Winkler

                  My opinions are my best interpretation of my experiences. They are not set in stone as I intend to always be a student of life. And Koi.



                  • #10

                    Alex, while in Japan looking for new parents sets last October, I could not find reasonibly price large kujaku. I had set what I thought was a good budget for a kujaku set, but prices were sky high (gosanke type prices), so shintaro set off on his own to track down a suitable set. He did me proud and came back with a 74cm female which he considered has all the atributes needed to produce good babies, these were coupled up with some nisai males.

                    I can't find the photos, so I'll try and take some more, but it must be before she spawns, less we'll be look at a skinny mummy.


                    • #11

                      Nearlies or keepers?

                      Hi Maurice,

                      You say nearlies, so where these nearlies part of the 300 you kept, or were they culled?
                      Regards, Bob
                      ><{{{{º> ><{{{{º> ><{{{{º>
                      <º}}}}>< <º}}}}><


                      • #12

                        comment and questions

                        Maurice, you should be proud of being obtanining such nice Kohaku. I believe you have se up an extremely high benchmark for your fry. These seem to be of high quality, but if you want to have everything including an exeptional breathtaking pattern... I believe you have to be lucky and/or play big numbers. I mean, a breeder producing around ten thousand millions of fry is more likely to obtain that exceptional fish instead a small breeder producing just one million of fry.
                        And talking about patterns maybe we could agree that not everybody has the same preferences...
                        Now I would like to ask a question
                        1. Why you think the koi at the bottom centre is going to develop as Shiro Muji?

                        2. Who has got more influence in the quality fo the fry, the parent male/s or the female? I have heard different answers and don't know what to think

                        Diego Jordano
                        Cordoba, Spain
                        A.E.K. web site
                        pers. web site


                        • #13

                          Hi Maurice,
                          Some very nice koi you bred there. How many fry do you expect you got from the Kohaku spawning?
                          The skin quality and body shape on these fry are outstanding, I like them big and strong too.
                          Well done ( Come on Summer )
                          Jaco Vorster
                          South Africa


                          • #14

                            Diego, I agree, the numbers game plays a big part in the chances of finding that show quality koi from a spawn, but the quality of the parents is the biggest factor when it comes to producing babies with future potential. You can have half a million babies from a rubbish parent set and not produce a single quality baby. Half a million fry from a top parent set may produce a few hundred of what we are looking for.

                            The kohaku in the bottom of the group shot is showing weak beni, fading from the kiwa edge. I may be wrong, but have seen many go that way. It’s still alive at this point, so we will see. (Picture below).
                            PS, this koi is in a way deformed, it’s shape is wrong, in that the body is too wide for it’s length, if it keeps it’s hi, it’s best chance is to end up at a garden center, even if it’s pattern was perfect, the shape is all wrong.

                            Bob, these koi are still on the keepers list, they will find a home, when time comes, even if they are not good enough for me to keep another season. But these decisions are made later in the season.

                            Jaco, you bring up a point about the build of the koi, that’s something I’ve thought about and wondered what Brady has to say about their build. I know he likes his koi lean!

                            Sorry the pictures are rubbish, it was dark and could not see if they were focused.


                            • #15

                              Maurice. of what bloodlines are your Kohaku dads?


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