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  • What is your perfect Filtration System?

    Interested in everyones opinion. I'm having a really hard time finalizing a water purification system for my pond (approx. 10K gal.) Everyone has been so helpful from all my previous posts, I just want to try and pinpoint my(and yours) ideas and really start getting the ball rolling. My first hurdle (wife approval) hahaha.. is checked off my list, now its a matter of fitting all the pieces together.

    Looking at a setup to accommodate a rectangular shaped pond 10'x30'(10K gal) with a 800-1000 gal. Q-Tank separated by the pond filtration area 8'x12' (or more available).

    I'm thinking of first using a vortex chamber (size?) for solids separation from bottom drains (3). Then pumping water from vortex through a sieve and then to the bead filtration system (Is this right? overkill?) To polish the water, I want to use a trickle tower (size?) and want to know if a UVC would still be required? Right now I'm planning to have the Q-tank on a separate bead-system and also thinking of using a small TT for the increased oxygen supplied for a Q-Tank. Is this beneficial for fish healing and or stress levels?

    I know there is a lot more stuff to consider...just would like to know what system(s) are working for other hobbiest. It would be good to know that I'm at least in the ballpark. Thanks all. Aloha!
  • #2

    aearators. YEP. propeller aerators, like they use in small ponds to move the water around.
    they are just small axial pumps. Great at moving HUGE volumes of water at very low heads.
    Consider one I found at Memphis net and twine for 4.7 amps at 115 volts it moves over 50,000 gph....so let's say they are lying...it can still move 30,000gph for 5 amps.
    I was thinking of having a flow through system. now I am at least going to try this first.
    It could be the next horizon....heck it is here now...no longer a horizon.
    I loved it when I saw the published GPM's......800+Gallons per minute! If you don't need that much then put a little head on the discharge side.........20,000gph through a Bakki tower that is four ft high 3ft wide and 20ft long?

    Comment

    • #3

      Hopefully you will get 27 reponses.....all with a different idea on how to work it.
      Each one will be sincere, each based on their own learned knowledge. So don't get discourage with so much to choose from. In a perfect world you would have a hobbiest close by with similar sourse water and stocking loads and pond size that you could emulate.

      I don't want to influence info to come so I will make a couple of broad statements.

      Each bottom drain needs a settling sump of it's own. Three feeds into a single vortex no matter how big it is, is a disaster waiting to happen.

      Why are you so high on bead filters? There is a place in this world for them but it's to retro fit an old pond that hasn't kept up with modern standards. Not a brand new one that can be designed properly.

      make sure you get a gauge and know exactly to the gallon what it is you pond actually holds, not just by math.

      Make sure all your electrical is on a ground fault interrupter.

      plan on a 24/7 trickle in of conditioned or treated water with overflow drain out.

      when you build your trickle tower make sure you have atleast a four foot drop
      thru media and if your smart you will pump air into the base of the tower and let it escape thru vent holes in the top under the drip tray.
      Dick Benbow

      Comment

      • #4

        Luke, if you want to move a lot of water and exchange a lot of oxygen with little amp draw, look into paddlewheels. There has been a lot of aerator engineering and testing for both sewage treatment and auaculture. Here is a quick summary from some of Claude Boyd's work at Auburn:

        AERATOR TYPE KG OXYGEN TRANSFERRED PER KW HR
        -------------- -------------------------------------
        paddlewheel .................................................. ........ 2.2
        propeller-aspirator (e.g. Air-O-2) ............................... 1.6
        vertical pump (what you found at Memphis N&T) .......... 1.4
        pump sprayer (shoots water in the air) ....................... 1.3
        diffuser (air stones, diffuser plates, etc) ..................... 0.9

        Akai, a popular set-up is:

        bottom drain -to- vortex settlement
        vortext -to- pump -to- kaldness moving bed biofilter
        kaldness -to- bead filter for fine solids removal -to- pond return
        or
        kaldness -to- TT for gas exchange -to- pond return

        I have low fish density and am cheap, so I use:

        bottom drain -to- settlement chamber
        settlement -to- pump -to- TT
        TT -to- pond return
        Has only about 4 feet of total dynamic head.

        Why are you stopping at 4.5 feet deep? That's about what I have, but I wish I could go to 6-7 feet. You could get half-again as much volume in the same footprint. Of course, your site may have some logistical or engineering constraint to going deeper.

        steve hopkins

        Comment

        • #5

          More in Dick Benbow’s line we think.



          Pond can always bee deeper

          Filter never have to high flow through

          You never can have too much air (NB is not right when experience our low temperatures, but its easier to turn off than dream in)



          Statements above are not applying to multi millionaires, but are fairly correct for the rest off us.



          Each output to its own filter line.

          Don’t save on chambers on the lines (the more the happier)

          Full bypass piping and separate flush to waist from every chamber (item)

          Keep pumps as far as possible to the end off each line
          Tone - Truls -Petter
          Vogata NI

          Comment

          • #6

            that's what I'm talking about! Excellent input!



            How about some others ( of course millionaires NOT excluded!)
            Dick Benbow

            Comment

            • #7

              In your shoes I woould do it thus:

              Three bottom drains to three Votex

              Three bow screened laser-cut sieves using the harmonica sock with float chamber like EA has or similar

              No Bead filter!

              Pumps and UV

              Trickle tower of choice.

              Now a skimmer can be attached to a beadfilter if you wish and pumped directly back into the pond as a TPR
              Semper in excreta, sumus solum profundum variat

              Comment

              • #8



                Originally posted by bekko
                Why are you stopping at 4.5 feet deep? That's about what I have, but I wish I could go to 6-7 feet. You could get half-again as much volume in the same footprint. Of course, your site may have some logistical or engineering constraint to going deeper.
                Originally posted by bekko

                steve hopkins
                I'm actually thinking of having a shallow depth of 4'-5' and deep end of 7' to follow the lay of the land of my property. I probably only have to dig 2'-3' because I am incorporating the pond as a part of a new raised front lanai. Put that on top of building a seat around the pond, making the top of the pond 24"-30" above my house floor line. I need to be sure to have overflow drains into my filter catchment and on the road side of my property to accommodate any overspill so that water doesn't have a chance to flood my home. I will still have open decking between pond and house, so that should take care of any water entering my home. Still debating final elevation of waterline to my finish floor.

                Comment

                • #9

                  Originally posted by dick benbow
                  Each bottom drain needs a settling sump of it's own. Three feeds into a single vortex no matter how big it is, is a disaster waiting to happen.

                  Why are you so high on bead filters? There is a place in this world for them but it's to retro fit an old pond that hasn't kept up with modern standards. Not a brand new one that can be designed properly.

                  make sure you get a gauge and know exactly to the gallon what it is you pond actually holds, not just by math.

                  Make sure all your electrical is on a ground fault interrupter.

                  plan on a 24/7 trickle in of conditioned or treated water with overflow drain out.

                  when you build your trickle tower make sure you have atleast a four foot drop
                  thru media and if your smart you will pump air into the base of the tower and let it escape thru vent holes in the top under the drip tray.
                  Thanks Dick,
                  Sump advice well taken. I guess I keep looking at bead type filters for ease of maintenance (so I think). No cleaning of filter sponges or matting to muscle. Of course that is based on proven backwashing of bead filters which I understand are far and few. Although I do have room for traditional biological filter setups, I do not want to spend the time or hard labor at maintaining water quality. What are the most modern and proven methods of filtration?

                  TT is something I am undecided. Whether to hide away or display openly in the pond with some screening. Last night at midnight I walked around outside trying get a feel of the noises that will be taken place in the area. I have to say, my neighberhood is very quiet and now I'm thinking that NOISE FACTOR will become more and more important as I progess with all this equipment. I know the TT generates a lot of sound (notice I didn't say noise), I will definitely visit some of the local ponds in the area that incorporate TT so that I can get a understanding of sounds associated with owning a KOI pond. Thanks again.

                  Comment

                  • #10

                    Akai-san

                    Most of the noise a TT makes comes from the manner in which the water leaves the TT itself. If you allow it to splash, it makes noise. If not, you hardly hear them.
                    Semper in excreta, sumus solum profundum variat

                    Comment

                    • #11

                      3 bottom drains, screens, static K and then to TT.

                      Comment

                      • #12

                        OK OK...I give...

                        I think I'm starting to grasp the understanding and the concept of dealing with heavy solids and trying to isolate and dumping solids before entering the filtration system. Using a possible combination of a vortex and seive at bottom drains. However, in the midst of selecting a filtration system...I have noticed that Bead type Filters or pressurized systems has been openly trashed by the experienced hobbiest/breeders. What else is out there that I have not looked into. A filtration system that does not require physical back breaking cleaning of filter sponges, matting, brushes, media etc. etc. Is a UVC and the TT (if sized right) enough for polishing water to go back into the pond? I feel like something is missing...but of course...I KNOW NOTHING! Thanks again people for all your wisdom and patience with this anal newbie. Aloha.

                        Comment

                        • #13

                          Originally posted by bil
                          3 bottom drains, screens, static K and then to TT.
                          bil

                          Static K? Sorry.

                          Comment

                          • #14

                            Google kaldnes.

                            It's a medium designed to work when fluidised. However, if kept static, it collects and holds fine particles without compressing them and forcing organics into solution.

                            Naturally it should not be used as primary solids removal, an dneeds to be fluidised to flush out solids regularly.

                            Comment

                            • #15

                              Thanks for the clarification bil. I did read a lot about filter media. I guess learning the abbreviations will come with time. TT, K, UV, BD, VC, SPP, BF, SP and the list goes on...hahaha.

                              Comment

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