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  • Koi Pond

    i am planning to build a koi pond soon but i have a lot of worries since i am a newbie when it comes to building ponds and their respective filtration system.

    the size of the pond that i am building is 13' 10'' long, 4' 5'' wide and 4' deep. So my first question is, how many gallons does this kind of pond have? (sorry i don't know how to calculate this) second question i'm worried that once i get my pond started my electric bills would go up, i mean i'd rather spend money on koi's and koi food rather than electricity, so what's the best type of filtration should i use? third...kind of pump i should buy? fourth....fifth...do i have to put oxygen pumps aside from the submersible pumps that most people use?

    please help me....

    Jason.
  • #2

    Hi Jason,


    The pond will be about 1470gls and you will need as big a filter as you can get or fit in.If you can try to keep all the pumps external from the pond and yes air pumps are a good thing.Don't worry about the costs unfortunatly once you get going in this hobbey money just seems to go and go and go weather you have it or not lol

    Gazza
    Regards

    Gazza

    Comment

    • #3

      koi pond

      Dear jackass
      Going off your dimensions your pond will be about 1600 gallons which i am afraid in my mind is not big enough to keep koi properly,i think koi need at least 3000 gallons and a depth more like six foot.
      A size of 12 foot X 8 foot X 6 feet deep aquates to 3600 gallons if of course you have the room.In which you could keep about seven koi.
      Yes you are correct about your electricity bills going up,also your water bill wiil go up lots as well.as quoted lots of times before its not a cheap hobby.
      I have a pond of 9500 gallons which is gas heated and this costs at a rough guess arond £100.00 a month, in gas, electric and water
      I use four sequence pumps on the system which i think are pretty good on running costs.
      As for filtration a bakki shower or nexus with k1 is the way to go.
      Finally yes use lots of air.
      good luck ,do it properly and enjoy.

      Comment

      • #4

        Hi Jason,
        Welcome to the board and the hobby. to get the volumn of water multiply the length times the width times the depth times 7.5. Here's a tip, borrow from a trusted dealer a water meter to use when you fill the pond and filters that way you will have an exact gallonage. You will thank me for that when it comes to
        any medication or other dosage you may have to extract to exacting standards!

        have found this rule as a helpful planning for ponds double the depth to get the width and double the width to determine the length.

        I don't know where you live but unless it's very temperate (warm) you may wish to go 6 feet deep. keep in mind that changes in temperatures suddenly
        is your koi enemy. more than 4 degrees in a day and you need a heater for insurance.

        I concur with Andy about sequence pumps. I have had nothing but good luck
        for operating costs and efficiency.Not the strongest with a large head to push. I know others who have done well with wave.


        Air is vital to filtration. to get around an air pump you can create your own trickle tower or bakki shower type where you use one pump to lift your water and the method of filtration supplies the air. I have both blue japanese filter mat ( 3 vortexes) and bakki tower (3 trays) with three air pumps making the vortexes look like jaccuzzi's. If your handy you can build your own. If not you can use prepared units with all the bells and whistles built in.
        don't scrimp on the filter.

        Finally don't over crowd your koi. start with 4-6 for your size pond. Buy the stronger types next to the natural magoi. Like asagi, yamabuki, chagoi. They
        are hardy and good to learn on. once you've got it down, you can go with the kohaku,sanke and more expensive types. later on you will probably want more show types but a good one of the survivors will compliment nicely.

        please stay away from buying a single koi from 6 dealers and mixing everything. Buy all 4 from one to start. later after you've gained some experience you'll want to have a good quaranteen facility to insure a healthy new introduction.

        other random thoughts include most rookie mistakes include over feeding.
        waiting too long to seek help when koi or water don't seem quite right. Start keeping your eyes open for a good microscope. to be able to identify a problem is more than half the battle. it always helps to have a trusted koi kichi or dealer to depend on for help while you learn. make sure your pump (electrical) is connected to a GFI ( other names in other countries but it keeps you from electricuting you self or your koi)
        Dick Benbow

        Comment

        • #5

          Maybe Akai-San will give you his plans since he is not going to use them :>)

          -steve

          Comment

          • #6

            so with the dimensions of my pond is it impossible to keep koi's? will the bakki shower be enough of a filtration and oxygen provider at the same time in my pond? the reason for this is that since i'm only starting out with my pond and koi's to put in it, i would like to have a very minimal flow of expenses, i'd rather spend a lot once i get more experience with this hobby.

            btw, i live in the Philippines.

            Jason.

            Comment

            • #7

              Jackass:

              If space is what is dictating your dimensions, then you have to work with what you have. My main concern is the width of 4.5'. That does not give much space for a 24" koi to turn around ... and you can easily grow 24" koi in two years in a warm climate. I'd really like to see it at least 6'wide. The deeper the better, but for a beginning pond I think a depth of 4' is fine. If you stay in the hobby, you will join the chorus of people who say that the cheapest koi pond is the one built right the first time. But, not many begin by spending that much money. If you are not focused on showing koi, a smaller pond may be just what will make you happy. I do think you need to try to reach at least 2,500 gallons, and the 3,000 mentioned above is even better. If you know that this will be a temporary pond ... one you keep for only a few years, then I'd suggest you look at getting EPDM liner. Much easier to tear out when you are ready to go bigger. If using liner, keep the pond rectangular ... no curves. It makes it much easier to avoid flaps of liner on the bottom where debris will be trapped. For filtration, make sure you install 4" bottom drain(s). [I've made the mistake of not having bottom drains. They are more important than whether you use one type of filter or another.]

              At the beginning you will end up with too many koi, they will get sick, you will have all but the ugliest die, and in the process you will either learn a lot and come back determined to do it right, or you will become frustrated and never buy a koi again. With a lot of work several days per week, you can keep good sized koi at a rate of one per 300 gallons; but for all but a few crazies, it is much better to think of one koi per 500 gallons. [And, when you are ready to get very high quality koi, you will want to think in terms of 1,000 gallons per koi.] I know, the little ones are so small and so pretty, that you think that there has to be room for just a couple more. Like I said, you'll end up with too many, they will get sick and most will die. So, do not spend more on koi the first year than you can afford to throw away. If you get them through an entire year, you will have learned a lot. Then you can give them away to new homes and buy what you like, confident that you know something about keeping them.

              There are several books in English covering the whole subject of koikeeping. Buy one or two, or get them from a library. I guess "Koi Kichi" is more than 8 years old now, but it is still worthwhile. Except for it, be sure the books are ones published in the past 8 years. Do not begin your pond until you have read two books cover to cover. You will find things they disagree about. Then you will have questions. That's a good time to come back to this board and ask.

              BTW, you must have a curious sense of humor to call yourself a jackass.

              Comment

              • #8

                hey Mikem, thanks for the reply, i really enjoyed the read, well that is true, i can't do anything right now but to work with what i have, i am still living with my parents, so it is their house that i'm building a pond, that is why i'm not trying to eat too much space. Me and my fiancee are beggining to plan our own house, so probably when i get my own place i will be able to build a bigger pond, anyways....like what i've said, i'm only starting so this will be a good start for me.

                well im glad you liked the name, a lot of my friends likes it too, he he he.

                Comment

                • #9

                  if you do go with the pond as discribed then i urge you to ,as practice will make perfect and you'll learn, think about 3-4 koi as the phillipines will grow koi like cracy. please plan on a way to have half the pond in shade for the health of your koi. lokk for tosai with very deep color and patterns as they will grow out of them soon.

                  in africa there is a very cute jackass penquin that gives a more positive spin to your "nickname"
                  Dick Benbow

                  Comment

                  • #10

                    There is a hotel on Maui that has a jackass penguin pond. Evidently, the climate suits this species. The penguin pond abuts a koi pond with some so-so fish.

                    ... and watch that spelling, Dick.

                    -steve

                    Comment

                    • #11

                      well i will keep that in mind....questions for you guys, the reason i went for four feet is to compensate for the lack of space in width and length of the pond, so would it still matter if i lower it to two feet? because i was wondering that if i lower the volume of water in the pond i wouldn't need a pump that will have a larger gph, lower gph=lower wattage=lower electricity, am i right here?

                      does everybody here agree when i say that bakki showers would be one of the best filtration and aeration system that i could use?

                      Jason.

                      Comment

                      • #12

                        Jason,

                        allow me to just address the filtration system. if i had to pick just one filtration method for the cost/results it would be a trickle system. The water from the mechanical filter is lifted up to the top of a trickle tower by pump and allowed to drip thru

                        quarter inch holes drilled every inch apart thru a drip tray.( stay away from the spray bar they eventually clog ) It trickles down thru a minimum of 4 feet of media and ends up in a catch basin at the base of the tower that is bulk head fitted to a return pipe to the pond. holes are drilled on the trickle tower itself just along the sides under the drip tray to allow air to vent out the top. I have had equal results with other filters but nothing ever better and nothing else close when considering costs. when it comes time to invest more in the system you buy an air pump and place airstones in the catch basin where the water collects after it's fall and runs back into the pond. the air increases the oxygen in the return water while producing an opposite flow up the chamber against the drop of the water and venting out the top under the trays. This would be like a supercharger to a car.
                        The only reason I constantly change my filtration is as an educator I want to give first hand knowledge to questions asked by my students to the latest technology. Not just a report i read somewhere. presently I have 4 two feet long koi in my inside pond of 2,000 gallons with 650 gallons in filtration. I use
                        a three decked bakki tower filled with BH media and 3 gigantic vortexes filled with blue j-mat each with an air pump per vortex and 5 lines of bubblers below the filter matting churning air in there like cracy. Over done? yep! in summer I move my 4 koi out in a 4000 gallon pond outside in my japanese garden, throw a switch and connect the vortexes to that system. At That time I will eliminate the BH shower. I refuse to sell my trickle towers ( I have 3) as some day i may fill them with bio balls and go back to them. hope some of this helped!
                        The only thing bad i could ever say about the Trickle system is that in cold temperatures/climates it acts as a cooling tower unless you stand for the expense of a heater or like me run it inside.( I also have a heater on it!)
                        Dick Benbow

                        Comment

                        • #13

                          Bekko

                          Steve:

                          You have to give Carl a break...Remember, he's civil service, so it takes longer to get things done...on second thought you may be right, some things never get done...

                          Aloha! Mike

                          Comment

                          • #14

                            Dick

                            Dick:

                            Your quote: "in summer I move my 4 koi out in a 4000 gallon pond outside in my japanese garden, throw a switch and connect the vortexes to that system. At That time I will eliminate the BH shower."

                            Why do you eliminate the Bakki Shower, especially during summer

                            Re: TTs: I've read different opinions re: volume of water which should be run through a TT for best results...Some have said no more than 50gph other have gone up to 500gph...

                            In your experience, what would the ideal volume be? My TT is a 70 gallon blue juice barrel filled with 7 Cu FT of Ultra Bio Media fed though a drip plate per your suggestion...

                            Thanks and Aloha! Mike T

                            Comment

                            • #15

                              Originally posted by dick benbow
                              Jason,

                              allow me to just address the filtration system. if i had to pick just one filtration method for the cost/results it would be a trickle system. The water from the mechanical filter is lifted up to the top of a trickle tower by pump and allowed to drip thru

                              quarter inch holes drilled every inch apart thru a drip tray.( stay away from the spray bar they eventually clog ) It trickles down thru a minimum of 4 feet of media and ends up in a catch basin at the base of the tower that is bulk head fitted to a return pipe to the pond. holes are drilled on the trickle tower itself just along the sides under the drip tray to allow air to vent out the top. I have had equal results with other filters but nothing ever better and nothing else close when considering costs. when it comes time to invest more in the system you buy an air pump and place airstones in the catch basin where the water collects after it's fall and runs back into the pond. the air increases the oxygen in the return water while producing an opposite flow up the chamber against the drop of the water and venting out the top under the trays. This would be like a supercharger to a car.
                              The only reason I constantly change my filtration is as an educator I want to give first hand knowledge to questions asked by my students to the latest technology. Not just a report i read somewhere. presently I have 4 two feet long koi in my inside pond of 2,000 gallons with 650 gallons in filtration. I use
                              a three decked bakki tower filled with BH media and 3 gigantic vortexes filled with blue j-mat each with an air pump per vortex and 5 lines of bubblers below the filter matting churning air in there like cracy. Over done? yep! in summer I move my 4 koi out in a 4000 gallon pond outside in my japanese garden, throw a switch and connect the vortexes to that system. At That time I will eliminate the BH shower. I refuse to sell my trickle towers ( I have 3) as some day i may fill them with bio balls and go back to them. hope some of this helped!
                              The only thing bad i could ever say about the Trickle system is that in cold temperatures/climates it acts as a cooling tower unless you stand for the expense of a heater or like me run it inside.( I also have a heater on it!)
                              do you have pics of these projects of yours? i would like to see how they look from your pond

                              Comment

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