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Mike Snaden..Finally got those showa photos

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  • Mike Snaden..Finally got those showa photos

    Finally got some close ups Mike. We were all having a discussion awhile back regarding sumi on the white ground..whether it comes up or not. Here some new photos as promised.
    10 1/2 inch Ooyama bred tosai
    Attached Files
  • #2

    thanks for posting. I think the black is really the highlite of that koi. The way it weaves it's way thru out the length. I have seen so many wonderful showa that have black on only one fin and seen many a hobbyist shy away from a wonderful koi because of that. I encourage our posters to honestly comment from their opinion, kinda an informal survey.
    Dick Benbow

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    • #3

      You can really see where that sumi is coming, I think it's going to be very nice... cool. How old?

      Terri
      Backyard Puddle

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      • #4

        Dan, I think you have a very nice tosai there.

        Since you asked for it, I hope you will not mind me commenting.

        As much as I can tell from a photo, the shiro is excellent. The sumi is too, but I have concerns about it getting overwhelming, especially in the mid section (there is sumi in the dorsal fin).

        The fact is: if there is no sumi on the pectoral fin at all, there will be no motoguro. So the fisnished fish will have inbalance in that area.

        A great young fish I would like to see pictures of as it evolves,
        Arthur

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        • #5

          Thats a very nice showa, but I am one that would shy away form it because of unbalanced pecs.. Bold and beautiful koi though

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          • #6

            Dick...would agree with your comment....."I have seen so many wonderful showa that have black on only one fin and seen many a hobbyist shy away from a wonderful koi because of that".

            In fact, and I know you would also agree, that lots of excellent koi in general, get passed on due to our western mentality of picking out the shortcomings and not just appreciating the overall package. So many times I will see people who are immediately attracted to a koi and then pick it apart based on book standards, followed by a choice of a lesser fish that is technically correct. If a koi lights your fire....there's a reason.

            Authur...thanks for the comments. Will be interesting to watch that mid section as you mentioned. By the way thanks for the nice visit a week or so ago.

            Terri....fish came from Japan in November as a tosai.

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            • #7

              Dan, I think it comes down to whether MikeS is right about the Sumi never finishing on the Shiro. If he is right, then a long term disappointment. If he is wrong, then an incredible pattern. You just need to get her to blossom in size to find out which sort of heartbreaker you have.


              When I asked the question on another board whether the Sumi over Hi was a reliable predictor of future Sumi development on adjoining Shiro, there were several knowledgeable koikeepers who said it was. I recall that Art L commented at some length that it was reliable. Snaden has pointed out the contrary. So, maybe it depends on the fish? LOL

              .....remember what Dick says. You gotta wait 7 more years to know for sure!

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              • #8

                Mike...never quite heard it put that way

                "You just need to get her to blossom in size to find out which sort of heartbreaker you have."

                Like your anology....think I'll call her "Heatbreaker". I can also certainly appreciate where Dick is coming from on the time necessary to keep showas. Rest assured she will not be going anywhere except here for a long, long time.

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                • #9

                  Dan if she were in my pond I would say that I would keep her to.. Why dont you enter her in a show when she get,s a little bigger. I think she is a beauty, sad to say I am one of those who look for perfection in a koi. I guess because I have purchased so many ugly koi in the past. When I first started with koi I did not know a thing about skin quality, pattern or type I just picked a koi that I liked and needless to say I picked koi you could not even identify. That has been three years ago and now I can name all of them and can pick a decent koi form a bunch of koi. Three years ago I was dumb as a brick when it came to koi, I just knew there was a passion burning inside of me for these fish and I have learned alot in that time and hope I can learn more.

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                  • #10

                    Smashing looking Koi Dan. So it doesnt tick all the boxes, but it does for me.
                    Regards, Bob
                    ><{{{{º> ><{{{{º> ><{{{{º>
                    <º}}}}>< <º}}}}><

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                    • #11

                      I think the one pec with motoguro and the other pec with no sumi still have the opportunity to balance out depending on how the sumi comes up/goes down on the fish. The balance has to do with the overall pattern. A mirrir image of motoguro on the pecs is not required.

                      Mike Pfeffer
                      Mike Pfeffer
                      Northern Midwest ZNA show
                      June 19 - 20, 2010
                      Season's Garden Nursery
                      Fishers, IN

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                      • #12

                        Koifishgirl...to me it depends on how one defines prefection. Many would say there are no perfect koi. I would tend to agree. There is however degrees of perfection..body shape, skin and color quality, pattern and overall appearance and presence. It's more the overall package for me rather than the lack of imperfection.

                        Although this showa lacks sumi in one pectoral, it cetainly makes up for it in the quality of the white ground, beni, sumi and pattern. Overall it lit my firecracker at one glance...no need to look any longer...I'll take it....and that was from a photo sent from Japan. However someone else may not like it as much as me. That's what makes the hobby fun...we all have different tastes.

                        Interesting discussion...thanks folks....where's Mike. Still interested in his read vs. sumi coming up on the white ground.

                        Comment

                        • #13

                          Mike must be back soon, he's just been out in Momo-land again.
                          Regards, Bob
                          ><{{{{º> ><{{{{º> ><{{{{º>
                          <º}}}}>< <º}}}}><

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                          • #14

                            It's good points far outweigh it's single demerit.


                            Nice fish.

                            rgds
                            Bern
                            South East Koi Club

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                            • #15

                              Dan, was interesting about the pec comments huh?


                              the same way there is a balance in a bonsai, i look for a balance in a koi's pattern. for me a shiro or showa needs to have a strong centering patch of black across the back in the dorsal area.

                              Several years ago I saw a shintaro showa that had one black pec and one white one that haunts me still. It was bought the day before I got there. Incredible koi!

                              I wish you'd take KFG's suggestion and enter it in Puget Sound's Show this August. Not alot around that will beat it!

                              (sure wish I could've gone with you to see Arthur!)
                              Dick Benbow

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