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Silk Worm pupae vs hi silk 21

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  • Silk Worm pupae vs hi silk 21

    Hi everyone,

    What is the difference between silk worm pupae and hi silk 21. I would like to purchase some for my koi during the summer months, but don't know which to purchase. Anyone used them before. Thanks for your responses.

    John
  • #2

    the pupae itself is a very sensitiove product. it needs to be processed quickly and correctly and bagged properly. you must feed it quickly so it does not spoil.
    Unless you have a large pond with many big mouths to feed i'd incourage you to consider hi silk where the food is more stable. Most who use the Hi Silk that i have talked to are happy with it. there were some problems associated with pupae.

    Will hope others will give you a widder range of experiences!
    Dick Benbow

    Comment

    • #3

      I have never used Hi Silk but I have been using pupae for years now. I initially got the supply from a local dealer here who obtained them from China. The quality wasn't too good and they went bad fairly easily. I am now sourcing them direct from Japan. I note the pupae from Japan are very well processed and smells great and crispy like prawn crackers....so much so that I feel like eating them myself! Small wonder that they are more expensive.

      What I do is cut each pupa into smaller pieces (about the size of your pellets) and mix them with whatever pellets I may be using. I never had to pre-soak them. What you will notice is that, pupae being very rich in fat, there will be a thin film of oil on your water surface very much like Saki Hikari. You will also see undigestable ?chitin on the surface.

      Hope this helps.

      Comment

      • #4

        I think when you ask most about Hi Silk there is no negative answer. You instantly hear about how it brightens whites. I have used it last season. This season I will start a little earlier. When getting silk worm I am not sure you can always be sure the quality of the silk worm. But like dtbh says you can import them.

        PS I would think about stocking up on Hi Silk 21 soon as it seems to disappear on the shelf rather quickly.


        Joe
        It's a living creature (chit happens)

        Comment

        • #5

          pupae

          for those of you who have used silk worm pupae before, is it true that you have to use it up within 6weeks after opening. I just recently got my pupae from ogata (3kg bag) and the label on the bag states that info. I wonder if we can take out wahtever neccesary and keep the remaining inside an airtight contanier coz i only wanted to feed pupae as a treat only once a week.

          Comment

          • #6

            Yes, i rate and would recomend Hi Silk 21 but, anyone know where in the UK you can get it?
            Andrew

            "Gentlemen prefer ponds"

            Comment

            • #7

              Originally posted by paulino88
              for those of you who have used silk worm pupae before, is it true that you have to use it up within 6weeks after opening. I just recently got my pupae from ogata (3kg bag) and the label on the bag states that info. I wonder if we can take out wahtever neccesary and keep the remaining inside an airtight contanier coz i only wanted to feed pupae as a treat only once a week.
              Dear paulino88,

              Even though I use up the pupae pretty fast I still keep them in airtight containers. The problem is that with a thin lining of fat the pupae do get moldy if left alone too long. Some hobbyists store the remaining pupae in their fridge.

              I note that the advice is to use pupa as a treat for your kois but as I have indicated I have been feeding them daily for years now at a frequency of 9x/day. I suppose I am in a different climatic condition in Malaysia whereby it is fairly difficult for our kois to retain fat if we feed them the usual pellets. I hope to overcome this "problem" by using silkworm pupae. I have, touch wood, not encountered any problems with this heavy feeding.

              Comment

              • #8

                Has anyone ever tried "live" silkworms? I raise live silkworms for my son's bearded dragon lizard. I think I may throw some in the pond when the water temperature gets warm enough.

                Mike Pfeffer
                Mike Pfeffer
                Northern Midwest ZNA show
                June 19 - 20, 2010
                Season's Garden Nursery
                Fishers, IN

                Comment

                • #9

                  I would like to thank everyone for the responses.Joe - Does Hi silk 21 really brighten the whites since you have tried it last season? ThanksJohn

                  Comment

                  • #10

                    Originally posted by jjkon
                    I would like to thank everyone for the responses.Joe - Does Hi silk 21 really brighten the whites since you have tried it last season? ThanksJohn
                    Sure it helps in brighten whites. But so does good genetics, water quality, water temps, fasting in winter and a well balanced feeding regime for your koi. Do I think a you can bring a yellow headed koi to come out white. Not sure about that. I think thats an uphill battle that I am not willing to try. But why was it yellow headed? Also a mudpond never hurts to help the whites as well

                    Hi Silk for me but like I said. There is a time and place for it. Don't feed it year round. This is when your feeding regime comes into play. What works for your area your pond. Your fish will tell ya what works

                    Joe
                    It's a living creature (chit happens)

                    Comment

                    • #11

                      Thanks Joe for your insightful information.

                      My koi were a little yellow on the fins after the winter is over. I took a koi to the hospital tank before of the fungus and heat the water to mid 70. The yellowish seemed to turn a little bit whiter.

                      Do you fast your koi during the winter? In the Bay area the weather temp was not as low as koi keepers in the north or east U.S. My pomd water temp was about 46 to 52 during the winter. I stop feeding when it is lower than 50. They did not get any feeding for may be a few days during the winter.

                      I am not going to feed hi silk 21 all year round. only in the summer month with water temp over 65.

                      John

                      Comment

                      • #12

                        Originally posted by jjkon
                        Thanks Joe for your insightful information.

                        My koi were a little yellow on the fins after the winter is over. I took a koi to the hospital tank before of the fungus and heat the water to mid 70. The yellowish seemed to turn a little bit whiter.

                        Do you fast your koi during the winter? In the Bay area the weather temp was not as low as koi keepers in the north or east U.S. My pomd water temp was about 46 to 52 during the winter. I stop feeding when it is lower than 50. They did not get any feeding for may be a few days during the winter.

                        I am not going to feed hi silk 21 all year round. only in the summer month with water temp over 65.

                        John

                        If they fins were yellow or rest of body yellow Excluding yamabuki, kigoi etc
                        It has a better chance of turning white. I dunno why this is maybe someone can chime in but in my experience this can happen better than yellwo head. Maybe its the consistency of color showing that shows all was white and can be brought back out

                        Do I fast my koi? You bet 6-8 weeks in the winter or even longer I have done. Its good to let them cleanse their bodies of anything to use precious fats that are stored. You will notice the color come up because of the. I stop feeding in the low low 50's I don't even wait until it drops under 50 I take the oppurtunity to go ahead and fast and stick with it! Even though my koi have picket signs up . Fasting is good as you also can see how much muscle girth the fish has. (confirmation)


                        Joe
                        It's a living creature (chit happens)

                        Comment

                        • #13

                          I guess the fresher the better and why not live silkworms. I see no issue with feeding live silk worms if you can get them. I have a hobbyist friend who is using live silk worms and his fish eat them up.


                          Originally posted by l113892
                          Has anyone ever tried "live" silkworms? I raise live silkworms for my son's bearded dragon lizard. I think I may throw some in the pond when the water temperature gets warm enough.

                          Mike Pfeffer
                          The world sleeps as the chance to learn something new passes.

                          Comment

                          • #14

                            I think the thing with using pupae is keeping it fresh. It starts to oxidize in a short amount of time and feeding your koi old food isn't good. I have a vacuum sealer that does the trick and I am able to store food alot longer and feed fresh everyday.

                            Hi-Silk I like overall, because it contains alot more than just Silk worm protein. Plus you can get away storing it longer if you like.

                            You can see a big difference in growth during the growing season and I think you wont be able to see the true quality until fall when the weather gets colder.

                            Originally posted by jjkon
                            Hi everyone,

                            What is the difference between silk worm pupae and hi silk 21. I would like to purchase some for my koi during the summer months, but don't know which to purchase. Anyone used them before. Thanks for your responses.

                            John
                            The world sleeps as the chance to learn something new passes.

                            Comment

                            • #15

                              If the koi's skin is a consistant color from tip of nose to end of tail with a pale yellow it has a better chance of cleaning up that a fish with a pale yellow head alone. Mind you this thought is good on "Gosanke and Shiro". This thought breaks all the rules when buying Koi, but it falls under tategoi rule. I would not be surprised under the right conditions that skin turning white in no time.
                              Also what I tend to do with my fish is put them through a cleansing process in early spring so that they will be ready for higher protein intake. Just be weary to always watch temps for optimized feeding conditions.
                              The world sleeps as the chance to learn something new passes.

                              Comment

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