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  • Hawaii Mud Ponds

    I just went on my son's class field trip to Kaneohe Shrimp farm. I was shocked to see such a setup in Kaneohe/Kualoa area. I know of the Kahuku site, but this one is much much closer to K-town. They have 2-one acre ponds and 4-half acre ponds. there is even a house on the property the overlooks the pond areas....cool! I made some stills out of some video footage of the place , but haven't figured how to pull out from the video camera yet. Standby.

    Hey Steve, do you know about this establishment? They actually pump in sea water from the ocean and mix with natural water source on site. "Brackish water" shrimp and prawns. Maybe if this business doesn't do well, we can get interested club members to get together and buy the place. Hahaha....Hey, I'm serious. Come-on Hawaii guys, whos in?
  • #2

    You're too late, grasshopper...It's rumored that the Kodama's of Koi on Line are in town to establish their own ponds in Mililani, on the side of the Island where the choosen ones live...Jumbo Tosai anyone?

    Aloha! Mike

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    • #3

      Those guys in Hakipu'u-Kualoa are my neighbors Akai. Most of their ponds sit empty. I have been trying to get them to rent pond space to me, but they say there is not enough water coming from the spring to keep them full. A friend is trying to rent pond space for koi in Kahalu'u, back behind Hygenic Store, where they have been raising catfish. There are also some nice ponds by Senator Fong's Gardens that they use for freshwater prawns. Wish I could find a deal like Kiefer has.

      -steve

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      • #4

        Originally posted by Mike T
        You're too late, grasshopper...It's rumored that the Kodama's of Koi on Line are in town to establish their own ponds in Mililani, on the side of the Island where the choosen ones live...Jumbo Tosai anyone?

        Aloha! Mike
        Mililani! I told my unlce not to sell his house... Man last year when I took old kam hwy I couldnt believe how built up the place got.

        Joe
        It's a living creature (chit happens)

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        • #5

          keo,
          my partner has a property in los gatos hills. He has a spring on his property, pouring out 120K gallons daily in the summer. he has 15 AC available. maybe we should rent the land from him ? or buy the 9 AC next to him that has 20K g right to this spring, asking price for that 9ac was 900K in 2002.

          stan

          Comment

          • #6

            Originally posted by saratogatan
            keo,
            my partner has a property in los gatos hills. He has a spring on his property, pouring out 120K gallons daily in the summer. he has 15 AC available. maybe we should rent the land from him ? or buy the 9 AC next to him that has 20K g right to this spring, asking price for that 9ac was 900K in 2002.

            stan

            ummmmm. I think rent! 900k back in 02.. Well tan maybe you can buy it.

            Joe
            It's a living creature (chit happens)

            Comment

            • #7

              Steve:

              Have you tried Unitiy House, they got the Hanohano land across from Pat's at Punaluu on foreclosure... The Hanohano's used to raise prawn there...

              Aloha! Mike

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              • #8

                Man, is THAT ever a long story Mike T. I have a friend who's family lost the land after putting it up as collateral on a really stupid investment - I mean REALLY stupid. I met a guy who is growing flowers and banana up there now and will find out what the deal is with those ponds. Its closer than Haleiwa, but Hakipu'u would be better.

                -steve

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                • #9

                  Koi and Hawaii, eh? You can count me in any day!
                  Brian Sousa
                  Koi-Bito Forum

                  Comment

                  • #10

                    Originally posted by Mike T
                    You're too late, grasshopper...It's rumored that the Kodama's of Koi on Line are in town to establish their own ponds in Mililani, on the side of the Island where the choosen ones live...Jumbo Tosai anyone?
                    The chosen one? May I ask who that is? Why are they looking into Mililani? Too many people! Why not peaceful Wahiawa area? I would think nicer and more manageable opportunity land there.

                    Anyone know where the best natural water sources is in Hawaii? I think maybe before purchasing property anywhere, water accessibility will be the key. Hey I hear Kauai has some awesome property with streams and rivers flowing through. And you know that Kauai has one of the "wettest areas" in the world. Water anyone?

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                    • #11

                      I propose that we form a venture, raise a couple of bucks to buy that land, and lease it out for koi boarding. Anyone interested ?

                      stan

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                      • #12

                        I am sure its not Miliani Town proper, but in that Miliani-Wahiawa area. My guess is that they will be using some of the abandoned ag land over there. The story is they will be using water from the Waiahole Ditch - water diverted from the windward side through the tunnel in the mountains for ag use in central Oahu.

                        -steve

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                        • #13

                          Hey Steve,

                          Are there any taro farms around? Maybe back in one of the valleys. Like rice farmers, is it conceiveable to have valley waters run through taro patches and other crops to appropriately treat water. Then introduce this water through natural pond filtration to be used in adjoining mud ponds. I guess one would need some means to control the amount of water running through the patches and adjoining pond areas. One massive rain could wash everything away....bummer.

                          I know our valleys aren't half as inaccessible as Niigata land areas. Just the question about the water. There has got to be a lot of land still available in the valleys....Just need a visionary....

                          Carl

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                          • #14

                            Akai-San,

                            I think the issue of growing koi in Hawaii is more about economics than suitable sites. There are ponds around, unused agricultural land for constructing new ponds, well water, and surface waters coming out of the mountains which are nearly as good as underground water. Of course, the cost of land is astronomical, electricity is expensive, salaries are high, and feed must be imported.

                            I see beautiful koi coming out of Korea which are very inexpensive. With our costs, I do not see how we could produce a comparable product at that price. I think Hawaii's competition in the koi market would not be Japan, but places like Korea, China/Taiwan, Indonesia, mainland US, etc. We would get to compete in the market for cheap fish, but we would not get to compete in the market for expensive fish.

                            Japan also has high land costs and high operating costs. However, Japan has the reputation and generations of experience. Show a customer two fish which appear identical and tell him this one was grown by Toshio Sakai in Japan and this one was grown by Joe Blow in Hawaii. Which one will they buy? They SHOULD prefer the Japanese fish. The breeder's reputation and eye for culling determines how the fish will develop over time.

                            You can buy the genetics, given a couple of decades you can develop the eye, but you will still not have the reputation. Fine koi is like any type of fine art. The perception is the reality. A famous artist is always going to command a higher price for his work than an up-start. Talent and quality are not the only determining factors.

                            You see the Japanese sending parts of their operations offshore. We have heard mention of Japanese koi operations in various parts of Asia and now Kodama is considering coming to Hawaii. However, these are still Japanese companies and they will make sure it is all very seamless for the dealers searching for Japanese fish. They did the same thing with the pearl industry and it took a very long time for non-Japanese companies to make in-roads into the international pearl markets.

                            -steve hopkins

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                            • #15

                              All too true Steve. I listen to the stories of people setting up mud ponds and breeding fish with mixed feelings. Recreating the environment is never the problem. On the one hand I applaud the attempt. Everything has to start someplace. But expectations of being able to compete with Japanese dealers with generations of experience are nothing less than naive.

                              I have a little bit of knowledge of how the Japanese system of apprenticeship works and I am certain these people aren't going to be giving their hard earned wisdom away any time soon. If foreign (i.e. non Japanese) breeders expect to compete they will do so by rediscovering the wheel on their own from the ground up. It might happen at some point but not in our generation.

                              Anyone can get a good set of parent fish and hatch fry. Putting them in mud ponds and growing them out isn't rocket science. But if they haven't been taught all the ins and outs of selecting which fish to cull and which one to keep they don't sand a chance of raising anything better than pond grade fish at best.
                              Semper in excreta, sumus solum profundum variat

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